Mixing modulation?

[Mr D]

Hi folks,

I mentioned this in my other thread, but i guess it'll get buried under my other, more specific question.

So in this thread i want to ask the general question: am i right in thinking that the Melda modulation system can't mix modulators?

As an example, take a look at the video below.

First, you see LFO 1 in Serum perform a slow filter sweep downward.

Next, you see me increase the amount of (fast) modulation LFO 2 sends to the same filter.

The net result is a downward sweep that also wobbles. So the Serum mod matrix must be mixing the modulation together.

When i try the same thing with the Melda modulation system, i just get a warbly mess as the two modulators are fighting against each other (I'm the boss! No, i'm the boss! No i'm the boss etc etc).

Please me know if I'm wrong and it is indeed possible!

Another example of needing this is if you want to use an envelope to control a filter, but also to have filter key-tracking at the same time. Again, the modulation would need to be mixed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FYEn1csAtU

[jmg8]

Are you using MSoundFactory? I assume so if you are comparing it to Serum. In that case, you can use the per-voice modulators. Here you can combine modulation sources in different ways. The most common is add (both modulation signals are added together) and multiply (one modulator scales the magnitude of the other).
If you are referring to the global modulators (available in most Melda plugins), this is different from Serum. Here the modulators are monophonic and you can only use one for each target. However, you can modulate the depth of another modulator, which will give the multiply behaviour. Maybe even add is possible too, by modulating the modulator's values.

[Mr D]

Thanks for the reply,

No, i'm not using MSoundfactory (i don't own it).

I'm trying to use MCCGenerator to build a custom synth in Patchwork. So, Serum Oscillators, The Drop filter, MCCGenerator for the LFOs, envelopes & filter key-tracking.
(as an example, there's much else i want to do with this same workflow of building custom devices with multiple plugins)

I don't think MSoundfactory would help me with this, right?

You said you can modulate the depth in global modulators, but i didn't manage to do that, there isn't a "depth" value as a destination (see pic below)

Perhaps MXXX has the tools to build something like what i'm talking about?

melda.jpg

[jmg8]

You are making a monophonic synth, right?

[Mr D]

Yes! Or a polysynth but with a global filter.

So just to explain, i tried using Diva for a Moog style monosynth, and although the filter is good, the oscillators are weird (phase-wise) and the envelopes are useless trash, hence my desire to hack something together with multiple plugins.

I already got great results, sounds way better than Diva, but i can't get filter key tracking and filter envelope to work together.

[jmg8]

Open a Modulator and check the box for "Assignable parameter range"
Now, with a second modulator, you can modulate the first modulator's ranges.
You can modulate the values and also depth (it will depend on the "Range mode" that you select for the first modulator)
The screenshot you shared is looking at the wrong place, scroll down (the left panel) a bit more until you see "Modulators"

In short, Mod 1 modulates the filter.
Mod 2 modulates the range of Mod 1.

[VariKusBrainZ]

Cant you achieve this natively in The Drop?

[Mr D]

Open a Modulator and check the box for "Assignable parameter range"
Now, with a second modulator, you can modulate the first modulator's ranges.
You can modulate the values and also depth (it will depend on the "Range mode" that you select for the first modulator)
The screenshot you shared is looking at the wrong place, scroll down (the left panel) a bit more until you see "Modulators"

In short, Mod 1 modulates the filter.
Mod 2 modulates the range of Mod 1.

ah-ha, thanks, i'm going to mess about with that!

[Mr D]

Cant you achieve this natively in The Drop?

Great idea, i tried it, it works!

So i did the key tracking inside The Drop, then mapped the LP filter to an incoming CC value from MCCGenerator, and it behaves as expected.

Still, would be nice to know if it's possible only with Melda mods, because very few plugins have key tracking built in. Actually, Serum FX does, so that's cool.

[Mr D]

EDIT!.......... ignore this post, see the next post for a better method!

OK, so i kinda got it working.

The trick was to make MOD 1 into an square wave LFO, 0 hertz, positive. So basically just outputting max non-stop.
Range set to "Full range".

Now you have two controls to tweak. These can be modulated with MOD 2 & 3.

A bit of a hack, a niche solution for a niche problem, but glad i got it working.

To be honest this should be easier to do in the Melda modulation system without the messing around!

Thanks for the help!

[Mr D]

Just in case anyone's interested, i found an easier way to do it (when using the LFO modulator).

First set up your LFO ("normal") modulation.

Turn on "assignable advanced shape parameters" in the bottom left of the "normal" wave window.

Next, turn on post processing in "advanced" and map a multiparameter to the "offset" knob. Set the multiparameter to value=-100 and max = 100. This will give you a full range of control, regardless of the LFOs value. But only if your modulator is set to full range. If you want a smaller range of initial modulation, but still want full range from the multiparameter (offset), you need to scale the modulation in the custom editor. So this is a mini-workaround but is not too bad.