Let‘s speculate about 5.2

[SLiC]

It isn’t just midi comping that’s missing, it’s midi capture, sending midi systex and a lot of basic midi editing tools. I’m disappointed they haven’t improved the midi side of the DAW in the last few years (not just this update) so yes, my prioritys and Bitwig seem to be divergent but it doesn’t stop me using Bitwig for the things I think it excels at. The benifit of using multiple DAWS is you can use the tools you like for the tasks that work best, there is no need to move on, I have all the options in all the DAWs.

Was the graphics acceleration a core issue that needed addressing? I never had a problem with the graphics personally, but I will see if I notice any difference when I download. I’ll wait a while though as there seem to be a lot of issues being reported.

[] Peter:H []

Compressor plus… i was right

Yes, hillarious. Compressor+ (I actually will still go with Melda Compressors) and a bunch of grid patch EQs with custom UI ... again I stick to Melda for bread & butter EQ tasks.
Not an update that catches me on the feature side. I'd rather expect such things from a saturated DAW like Cubase 13 which added use case specific compressors on top of a existing abundance of compressors...
But where's cool Midi stuff? I bet we have to wait for 6.x to get basic/commodity features other DAWs have on board since years ...

Nevertheless I respect that they invested in GPU, aka get rid of technical dept. If a company dishes out feature after feature without respecting the technical foundation, then the product will slowly degenerate over time and it's getting harder and harder to add features...

[Trancit]

I think it is a bit early to judge the shortcuts.

I really don't understand all this excitement. I generally try to use tools that fit my workflow. If midi comping is a primary need for you, I really don't get why you use Bitwig.
Also in KVR there was a huge debate about hardware acceleration, some people saying that Bitwig is unusable, now I understand that the new story is nobody care about it.

Finally for the devices, you may be incredibly productive and smart but on my side, even if I have full izotope and full Fabfilter, I will need a few days or weeks to decide if I don't use them. For example I still use EQ2 and EQ+ a lot because of the incredible easiness of side chaining, way more practical than pro Q3 (that I love for other features).

So in short, it seems a lot of drama for nothing.

I personally have never had any problems with GUI so it´s nothing noticeable for me...
I accept and like that they changed it... just in case that in future I most likely will never get in trouble... but it´s nothing I would renew my upgrade plan for...

It´s easy to say you try always to use the tools that fit your workflow... does Bitwig really doesn´t lack of anything you would really like to have (and which exists in really every other product out there... just in Bitwig not) while other areas are covered over and over and over again???
If you are really 100% happy and you don´t miss anything it´s understandable that you cannot follow the excitement...

Many though... me included... do have certain wishes nonetheless Bitwig offers already many tools "we" like and rely on and aren´t really available in other products you could easily swap to...
And if you are in that position it´s simply frustrating that the devs only follow the same pattern over and over and over again to release one device after the other which most have covered already hundred times, 90% in a much better quality but never touch the "real problem zones" ...
Is this so hard to understand??
I have no need for CPU hog devices like the new Compressor, Saturator etc... which take about 10 times more CPU than their 3rd party counterparts and not even reach the same quality just to have it "native"...
I have no need for some EQ´s or a clipper which I get for free in at least the same quality at literally every corner...

This is imho "luxury stuff" I can release if everything else is in the right order and have nothing else to do...
In Bitwig it´s the other way round... there is a ton of stuff missing really everybody else has got already and it stays with the same pattern: 80% sounddesign vs. 20% workflow...
It´s not that it would make Bitwig unuseable or similar nonsense... it´s just frustrating if you are left out over and over again being bombarded with tons of for you useless stuff instead of something you wish for...

Of course froums and surveys do not show the full picture but I have seen tons of requests for typical "DAW" stuff but never a request for a new compressor but the end result is always the same...
Getting stuff people don´t request but nearly never get anything requested... (I know the graphic engine is an exception but how often did this happen...)

It´s actually beyond my understanding that somebody cannot get the excitement...

Nevertheless it´s unlikely that this will ever change as it´s a repeating Pattern in Bitwig since it´s start and people unhappy with this direction must decide at least now if Bitwig is really the product they want to settle on...
In this point you are 100% right!

[Dionysos]

I’m disappointed they haven’t improved the midi side of the DAW in the last few years (not just this update) so yes, my prioritys and Bitwig seem to be divergent but it doesn’t stop me using Bitwig for the things I think it excels at. The benifit of using multiple DAWS is you can use the tools you like for the tasks that work best, there is no need to move on, I have all the options in all the DAWs.

Fair enough. Maybe I was thinking "move on" more in terms of "in your mind", and in how much it's worth venting about it at every opportunity on internet forums.

Was the graphics acceleration a core issue that needed addressing?

It never affected me either, but I'm using a single-resolution screen and the issues seemed to mostly affect users on high-DPI screens. And those are only becoming more common, so I can imagine that it'll prevent issues for a large portion of potential and existing users. In any case it doesn't strike me as work that a developer would take on for fun.

This is imho "luxury stuff" I can release if everything else is in the right order and have nothing else to do...

Keyboard navigation is not luxury stuff. It's something you want to get right before you add loads of other features for which it then has to be retro-fitted as well.

[Trancit]

This is imho "luxury stuff" I can release if everything else is in the right order and have nothing else to do...

Keyboard navigation is not luxury stuff. It's something you want to get right before you add loads of other features for which it then has to be retro-fitted as well.

I didn´t mean this special part with this sentence but the 9999th and 10000th device...

But no to your statement... how can I implement the keyboard shortcuts if the final featureset isn´t settled... you do not build the roof until you have at least the walls standing... (said in an extreme way)...
Imho first comes the wished featureset... than I optimize it´s workflow.
The other way round will just lead to people having adopted to a (for me) quite confusing system to unlearn everything again afterwards and learn something else because the available featureset has changed...

[Dionysos]

But no to your statement... how can I implement the keyboard shortcuts if the final featureset isn´t settled... you do not build the roof until you have at least the walls standing...

It seems like we're in disagreement about what's the roof and what's the walls (or the foundation).

[SLiC]

Fair enough. Maybe I was thinking "move on" more in terms of "in your mind", and in how much it's worth venting about it at every opportunity on internet forums.

This was literally a thread for 'speculating' about what may or may not be in an update and what we wanted...everything on this thread is a (fun) waste of time! Expressing disappointment or happiness with the update...all equally pointless but I am in my office at work and its killing time until I get back to my studio

I have already moved on, I had high expectations after what seemed like quite a long wait. I don't know why but I really thought this was going to be the 'midi' update after Live got the midi editor improvements, but it is what it is...

I still enjoying reading what others are saying who have tried the beta, I have an active plan and will download it when its released. I don't really have anything else to add until then, so I leave you in piece!

[Jac459]

It´s easy to say you try always to use the tools that fit your workflow....

Not really. I tried a lot of DAWs and I still use an hybrid solution (but fair to say 99.9% is bitwig).

But my point was to say that I prefere not to rely on hope of new features for a software and construct my workflow on stuffs that exists. And as such, I am not going overexcited or sad when a new version is there. It is just nice to havve.


The reason why I am saying that is that in my previous DAW, reason studios, I was dealing with over-frustrated people because vst3 wasn't supported for a long long time. And then people were going mad about it. For me, the day it became an issue, I just moved to another DAW.

But anyway. I understood you mate, no issue.

[pdxindy]

and a bunch of grid patch EQs with custom UI

The new EQ's are not grid patches.

[pdxindy]

Was the graphics acceleration a core issue that needed addressing?

Yes

[SLiC]

Was the graphics acceleration a core issue that needed addressing?

Yes

Never had an issue personally so it must just be some users.

[] Peter:H []

and a bunch of grid patch EQs with custom UI

The new EQ's are not grid patches.

Which is as much speculation as my take was ... or do you want to out yourself as a bitwig dev which can tell the very truth about the nature of the EQs?
Anyway. I don't care about the new EQs, so I'm not going to start a fight about your vs my speculation.

[pdxindy]

and a bunch of grid patch EQs with custom UI

The new EQ's are not grid patches.

Which is as much speculation as my take was ... or do you want to out yourself as a bitwig dev which can tell the very truth about the nature of the EQs?

I just repeated what the developers themselves said.

Plus it's obvious too. The devices that are grid patches such as Polymer and Filter+ can be converted to grid patches and the UI's use Grid elements. Neither are the case with the EQ's.

[pdxindy]

Was the graphics acceleration a core issue that needed addressing?

Yes

Never had an issue personally so it must just be some users.

Many people have reported issues with a sluggish GUI. There have been multiple threads about it. The new beta is for sure snappier in the UI. Time will tell what the benefit is across the userbase.

Since the CPU is no longer using cycles to render the GUI, there must be more for the audio. That will benefit everyone, whether they experienced an obvious sluggishness or not.

[SLiC]

Was the graphics acceleration a core issue that needed addressing?

Yes

Never had an issue personally so it must just be some users.

Many people have reported issues with a sluggish GUI. There have been multiple threads about it. The new beta is for sure snappier in the UI. Time will tell what the benefit is across the userbase.

Since the CPU is no longer using cycles to render the GUI, there must be more for the audio. That will benefit everyone, whether they experienced an obvious sluggishness or not.

This may be a side benefit of using the GPU - Theming!
(I am on a fairly high end NVidea Win 11, maybe that why I never had issues)

https://youtu.be/z4wCmJWyADE?si=Q7bAWC3JXpOXvkhv