TAL Drum - discussion

[e-musician]

I would also like to have a sequencer for TAL-DRUM.

But ... depending on how difficult it is to implement such a feature in TAL-DRUM, a possibly better alternative might be a completely new product which could be called TAL-SEQ or TAL-DRUMSEQ.

This could be a very basic grid sequencer that could be designed for TAL-DRUM in particular, but could also be used for other drum samplers such as Sitala or Speedrum.

It could be something like Cubases's very own Beat Designer but much simpler.

Here is my suggested feature list:
- 16 tracks/lanes (with track number #1 at the top and track #16 at the bottom), 16 steps per track; parameters: trigger note, velocity (maybe also per step), MIDI channel, mute/solo
- resizable GUI (maybe customizable in terms of colours)

AFAIK, no other developer currently has such a product in their portfolio (HY-RPE2 only has 8 tracks, and its GUI is a little cluttered IMO; HATEFISh RhyGenerator by HoRNet is a pure Euclidean sequencer that does not allow setting the steps manually).

[EmptyVessel]

yeah I get the application for sure, I used to use the OG Geist in that way. It makes the plugin more like a standalone hardware drum machine. Patrick and I chatted a bit about it since some more people have been mentioning it so he's giving it some thought. I'd be surprised if it makes it into this update but if not maybe we can put together a sort of dream feature list and see what happens. I tend to just use my Elektron Analog RYTM but there's obviously some appeal to having something like that feature-set in TAL Drum.
Thanks for the thoughts.

[gauderbock]

standalone hardware drum machine

Yep, 100% genau this!

[EmptyVessel]

I would also like to have a sequencer for TAL-DRUM.

But ... depending on how difficult it is to implement such a feature in TAL-DRUM, a possibly better alternative might be a completely new product which could be called TAL-SEQ or TAL-DRUMSEQ.

This could be a very basic grid sequencer that could be designed for TAL-DRUM in particular, but could also be used for other drum samplers such as Sitala or Speedrum.

It could be something like Cubases's very own Beat Designer but much simpler.

Here is my suggested feature list:
- 16 tracks/lanes (with track number #1 at the top and track #16 at the bottom), 16 steps per track; parameters: trigger note, velocity (maybe also per step), MIDI channel, mute/solo
- resizable GUI (maybe customizable in terms of colours)

AFAIK, no other developer currently has such a product in their portfolio (HY-RPE2 only has 8 tracks, and its GUI is a little cluttered IMO; HATEFISh RhyGenerator by HoRNet is a pure Euclidean sequencer that does not allow setting the steps manually).

I doubt it's more or less difficult to make it standalone or as part of the plugin (apart from GUI considerations). If it was part of TAL Drum but also sent out MIDI then it solves both use cases.
Thanks for the ideas

[seangm]

Just my 2c, I like having an all in one plugin with the sequencer built in like a drum machine. Hoping he gives it some consideration but I understand it might be some work.

[chibchan]

TAL Drum is getting some love with a v2.0.0 beta update
https://tal-software.com/products/tal-drum#changelog

UPDATE: VST 2 and 3 version failed reaper 6.80 scan on linux debian bookworm.
Clap passed scan.

[chibchan]

Clearing (right click clear pad) more than 1 pad freezes reaper.
Hopefully future versions will be able to drag more than 1 sample (shift or control click) from sample browser at once.

[EmptyVessel]

Clearing (right click clear pad) more than 1 pad freezes reaper.
Hopefully future versions will be able to drag more than 1 sample (shift or control click) from sample browser at once.

I did speak to Patrick about dragging multiple samples and he agreed it was a good idea. He only had so much time to add things for this update so I'm not sure if that's in there this time or not tbh, I don't currently have time to look at the beta.
Bug reports are probably more effective sent direct if that's not too much of a pain? Patrick very seldom (if at all?) checks in here.

[chibchan]

Bug reports are probably more effective sent direct if that's not too much of a pain? Patrick very seldom (if at all?) checks in here.

I do send bug reports to Patrick and post them here as well .
I did ask Patrick if there was a discord or alike where bugs can be posted as it can be much easier to track.

[fladd]

The update is nice. Unfortunately, the new 12 MIDI mapable knobs are per pad for some reason, which makes them pretty useless

They really should be global. I should be able to map, for instance, sample start to P1 and sample end to P2. Then, they affect sample start and sample end on whatever pad I am currently selected on. When I switch pad, the mapping changes along. Otherwise it is impossible to use an external hardware (unless you have 128 knobs for a mapping sample start/end for all pads, but even that wouldn't work, because there are only 12 mappings in TAL-DRUM). And that is what MIDI mapping is all about, isn't it?

[EmptyVessel]

Bug reports are probably more effective sent direct if that's not too much of a pain? Patrick very seldom (if at all?) checks in here.

I do send bug reports to Patrick and post them here as well .
I did ask Patrick if there was a discord or alike where bugs can be posted as it can be much easier to track.

Ah nice one, thank you
We have discussed making a Discord, I'm happy to create and look after it if it's actually something that would get significant use. I made a FB group but FB is a hard sell now

The update is nice. Unfortunately, the new 12 MIDI mapable knobs are per pad for some reason, which makes them pretty useless

They really should be global. I should be able to map, for instance, sample start to P1 and sample end to P2. Then, they affect sample start and sample end on whatever pad I am currently selected on. When I switch pad, the mapping changes along. Otherwise it is impossible to use an external hardware (unless you have 128 knobs for a mapping sample start/end for all pads, but even that wouldn't work, because there are only 12 mappings in TAL-DRUM). And that is what MIDI mapping is all about, isn't it?

Mmm yeah that really doesn't make sense, they should be global surely. I'll check in with Patrick.
thx

[[nx]]

+1 for TAL Discord

[ToguAudioLine]

The update is nice. Unfortunately, the new 12 MIDI mapable knobs are per pad for some reason, which makes them pretty useless

They really should be global. I should be able to map, for instance, sample start to P1 and sample end to P2. Then, they affect sample start and sample end on whatever pad I am currently selected on. When I switch pad, the mapping changes along. Otherwise it is impossible to use an external hardware (unless you have 128 knobs for a mapping sample start/end for all pads, but even that wouldn't work, because there are only 12 mappings in TAL-DRUM). And that is what MIDI mapping is all about, isn't it?

Hi, thanks for the feedback. The new 12 parameters are global. The idea is that you are using them in the MOD-Matrix. for example to modulate the cutoff frequency. You can select multiple pads or mappings to make the assignment. This way you can modify the mod matrix pretty fast for all pads in one step. But you can't modulate Start/End of a sample mapping with them. They are here for host automation. Something that isn't possible for every parameter of each mapping.

But I see what you mean. You want to use your MIDI controller control the current selected pad/mapping for the configuration of the settings and not for automation. The CC's should stay the same when you change the pad view.
Some people may still want to MIDI-automate things and do not need that feature. Maybe there should be a switch somewhere in the settings to enable a "single panel" mode that only works for the current selected pad/mapping. We could use the mapping of the first pad for this.

I have to think about it.

[ToguAudioLine]

There will be a Panel Mode button on the top right of the plugin in the next update similar to TAL-J-8. All MIDI LEARN parameters will be used on the visible UI mapping or pad when this mode is enabled.

[fladd]

Thanks for implementing this so quickly, the panel mode now does the expected thing!

One last thing I really miss from TAL-DRUM is that it does not report pad names as midi notes to the host. It would be great to have that feature implemented at some point, since this would facilitate sequencing in the DAW by a lot (currently the best I can do is to manually rename the notes in my DAW to "Pad 1" to "Pad 16", but then I still have to guess what sounds are on each of them while sequencing).