DIVA Trimmers: Voice Detune VS. Stack Detune

[mholloway]

I need some help understanding the specifics of the Trimmer functionality when I'm using Unison Stacking in DIVA.

If I set Stack to, say, 4, then when I hit one key I see four voices light up in the Trimmers > Oscillator Voice Detune section. I'd assume all the (per-oscillator) detune knob values will be applied, as set, to those four voices that are playing.

But, I also now have the option using the "Stack Tune" section over to the right, which also contains a knob per voice....

So my question is, what exactly is the difference between the detuning, per voice in my 4 voice stack, that occurs from turning the Oscillator Voice Detune knobs for voices 1 -4 and the (separate) detuning from turning the Stack Tune knobs for Voices 1 - 4 ... since in both cases (Voice Detune and Stack Detune) each knob represents an individual voice, it seems potentially redundant...

...so is it just a cumulative effect? Is the only difference that the Stack Detune knobs have a much wider (2 octaves) range than the knobs in the Oscillator Voice Detune section? (May have just answered my own question there, but would still like it confirmed, maybe I'm not thinking of something else??)

cheers,
-M

[drzhnn]

As I understand it, Stack voice is a copy of whole patch, and Stack Tune knobs allow setting the pitch of a particular copy in the stack.

Oscillator Voice Detune knobs detune voices of oscillator module (a row of knobs per voice). For example Triple VCO has 3 oscillator voices and you can control each voice detune offset with these Oscillator Voice Detune knobs. Thing is, unlike individual Detune knobs in the oscillator module itself, the Oscillator Voice Detune knobs will iterate depending on the polyphony of the patch. So each time you hit the key on MIDI keyboard a different combination of detune offset (for oscillator voices) will be applied. And with Detune Amt knob you can control the depth of this effect.

[mholloway]

As I understand it, Stack voice is a copy of whole patch, and Stack Tune knobs allow setting the pitch of a particular copy in the stack.

Oscillator Voice Detune knobs detune voices of oscillator module (a row of knobs per voice). For example Triple VCO has 3 oscillator voices and you can control each voice detune offset with these Oscillator Voice Detune knobs. Thing is, unlike individual Detune knobs in the oscillator module itself, the Oscillator Voice Detune knobs will iterate depending on the polyphony of the patch. So each time you hit the key on MIDI keyboard a different combination of detune offset (for oscillator voices) will be applied. And with Detune Amt knob you can control the depth of this effect.

Yeah, I understand that the Voice Detune iterates through the voices, it's clearly visible, they light up to show which voice is active... everything you say in paragraph two is correct, but tbh I already knew it all, and it doesn't help me understand what the Stack Detune is (or isn't) doing any better.

As for your first paragraph -- sorry but it doesn't make any sense to me / isn't clear what you're describing. A "stack voice is a copy of a whole patch" -- what does that mean ? I think you're possibly overthinking / making more complex what the stack actually is. There's no copy involved, as I see it: when you set Stack to 4, one key press results in 4 voices getting triggered. You can see this clearly, since four lights will light up under the voices in the Voice Detune section. Set it to six, six voices light up. So, all the stack does is receive a number from 1 to 6, and then play that number of voices whenever you hit a single key. So I can only assume the "Stack Detune" knobs, which are enumerated 1 to 6, correspond to the individual voices in the stack. If you set Stack to 4, the last two Stack Detune knobs are meaningless, as those two voices aren't being used in the stack.

So, assuming I'm correct and each Stack Detune knob represents one voice in the stack, they do functionally overlap with the voice detune knobs in the Voice Detune section. And as stated in my OP, I *think* the only functional difference is that they span a much greater pitch range -- 2 octaves. But I'm trying to figure out if there's more to it than that.

cheers,
-M

[EvilDragon]

Stack is "unison mode" in Diva, and Stack Detune is "unison detune". Look at it that way.

[drzhnn]

Well... Diva's tabbed UI and the way they labeled everything as "voice" and "detune" doesn't really help much in understanding or explaining things . But I don't think I'm overthinking the concept of Stacks. Maybe generalizing a little bit, but for me it's just easier to see stack voice as an instance of a whole patch (including oscillator, filters, lfos etc). In this scenario the Stack Tune knobs act as transpose controls for each copy of a patch. And this is basically what they do. If you set Stack amount to 1 you can see that Stack Tune 1 knob work as a global transpose control for the whole patch. If you set Stack amount to 2, you now have two copies of a patch playing at the same time and with Stack Tune 1 and 2 knobs you can transpose each copy separately. Also, seeing stack voices as individual copies of a whole patch helps understanding the purpose of StackIndex modulation control. With it you can address and offset specific parameters among the patch copies in the stack. So you can create multi-pole filters for example.

[mholloway]

Well... Diva's tabbed UI and the way they labeled everything as "voice" and "detune" doesn't really help much in understanding or explaining things . But I don't think I'm overthinking the concept of Stacks. Maybe generalizing a little bit, but for me it's just easier to see stack voice as an instance of a whole patch (including oscillator, filters, lfos etc). In this scenario the Stack Tune knobs act as transpose controls for each copy of a patch. And this is basically what they do. If you set Stack amount to 1 you can see that Stack Tune 1 knob work as a global transpose control for the whole patch. If you set Stack amount to 2, you now have two copies of a patch playing at the same time and with Stack Tune 1 and 2 knobs you can transpose each copy separately. Also, seeing stack voices as individual copies of a whole patch helps understanding the purpose of StackIndex modulation control. With it you can address and offset specific parameters among the patch copies in the stack. So you can create multi-pole filters for example.

Ok, I see what you mean now.

I guess the word 'copy' throws me off because, for or my brain anyway, it's just easier to think of it as 'how many voices will be used for each note that is triggered'. And 'copy' feels wrong because in a Stack of two, the second voice will use different knobs in the Voice Detune section than the first voice, so you see what I mean? It's not an identical copy, it's just the next voice from the synth. Three voice stack, you see three voices light up in the Voice Detune, and depending how you've set the knobs there, they could all be tuned slightly differently....which, for me, doesn't fit the idea of "copies."

[drzhnn]

My bad. By "copy" I didn't mean like the exact audio copy of the output, but the copy of the whole diva instrument with all its main controls, which would sound a bit different because of the osc phase, detune, slop behavior etc. Anyway, here's a picture of how I see it. Hope it makes sense.

[mfaenza]

Great work on that mock up of the GUI @drzhnn

[bartok2112]

Anyway, here's a picture of how I see it. Hope it makes sense.

This diagram is super helpful! U-He, please consider adding it to the manual.