bitwig 2 is here

[SLiC]

Yup- As a eurorack user the CV out stuff looks interesting, there is already the ES-8 but also rumours of other USB- CV output devices for use with software like Reactor and BWS

also curious about the CV stuff, but with Expert Sleepers 'Silent Way' available to use with all VST hosts, it's not a 'killer feature' that is going to lure me into wearing the gimp suit I'd be expected to wear when signing up to this new 12-month-subscription-fees-for-bug-fixes scheme of theirs. Nevertheless, I'll be keeping tabs on this feature out of curiosity and of course relevance to my hardware setup.

Personally I will just upgrade as soon as its available, its 160 bucks, cheap as far as I am concerned and I don't care what happens after a year, I will decide if its worth paying again then. For now, the upgrade is worth the money for me, cant wait.

[grains of sand]

The only ones hurting their bussines is BW itself with this new model.

Comparing Propellerhead Reason with Bitwig's upgrade plan.

Reason 7 March 12, 2013
>>> 18 months <<<
Reason 8 September 30, 2014
>>> 21 months <<<
Reason 9 June 21, 2016

Reason upgrade $129 for 1 major update
Bitwig upgrade $169 for at least 2 major updates
(unless Bitwig doesn't release one in over 12 months)

$40 extra to receive at least 1 extra major update with a 1/3rd of the wait time

Plus they avoided the subscription model so users could hold onto their perpetual licenses with the option to upgrade or not upgrade at anytime. Seems like a great new perspective and lens to look through.

Further comparison with something like Slate Digitals Everything Subscription model.

If you pay the $15 a month for 12 months it ends up being $180 a year and you don't even own the license.

Putting things in perspective, I'm sure there are other upgrade comparisons that would further support the obvious advantages of Bitwig's new model.

The main factor being that Bitwig at anytime during the year can release multiple major features at no extra cost, this is the part people have a hard time justifying and appropriating the overall value for the extra $40 a year, which is slightly less then 3 monthly Slate payments.

[marvotron]

I don't think its that daft but I'm already used to the same scheme being used by Jetbrains. The Bitwig proposal is very similar to where Jetbrains ended up after proposing a subscription only model, listening to 2 weeks of internet shouting and coming up with this :

https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2015/09 ... ouncement/

There are a couple of differences which I think Bitwig would be wise to consider :

1. Continued subscription reduces the price each year up to about 40% reduction
2. Current customers with active or recently expired upgrade subscription get first two years of subscription for the price of one.

The reasoning behind the move was effectively the same as Bitwig, instead of holding back features to bundle into a shiny new version they would just keep rolling out new features and bug fixes as fast as possible. That's exactly what has happened, im totally happy with my Intellij subscription.

[Daags]

Yup- As a eurorack user the CV out stuff looks interesting, there is already the ES-8 but also rumours of other USB- CV output devices for use with software like Reactor and BWS

also curious about the CV stuff, but with Expert Sleepers 'Silent Way' available to use with all VST hosts, it's not a 'killer feature' that is going to lure me into wearing the gimp suit I'd be expected to wear when signing up to this new 12-month-subscription-fees-for-bug-fixes scheme of theirs. Nevertheless, I'll be keeping tabs on this feature out of curiosity and of course relevance to my hardware setup.

Personally I will just upgrade as soon as its available, its 160 bucks, cheap as far as I am concerned and I don't care what happens after a year, I will decide if its worth paying again then. For now, the upgrade is worth the money for me, cant wait.

ya, it seems many of those who aren't outright against the new scheme, are willing to give it a shot for one year and see what it's like. which I don't think bodes well, but at least it's some form of support.

I can see how it might be easy to talk oneself in to trying it for at least a year ... because you're already primed for an upgrade, and thus upgrade fee. i hope it works out for you.

contrary to what some might think, I want Bitwig to succeed .... at least the Bitwig that advertised so much, for so long (and is yet to deliver, effectively breaking significant promises). Even if it's with a scheme that I find abhorrent, a scheme I would never support in its current incarnation ... I would still like to see Bitwig succeed. If for no other reason than to offer an alternative to Ableton Live, as competition is better for the consumer at the end of the day.

[robotmonkey]

Geez. Isn't Bitwig supposed to be the best daw ever? The daw to end all daws. The saviour of daw world. The miracle daw. At least according to all hype preceding the release of it.

Can't believe what I'm reading. Instead of celebrating the second coming there's over 30 pages of complaining about petty things like price and features.

[fandango]

When the funny cat pictures disappeared, I knew the Bitwig honeymoon was over.

The cats are being replaced by donkeys. Dead ones.

[mellotronaut]

Further comparison with something like Slate Digitals Everything Subscription model.

If you pay the $15 a month for 12 months it ends up being $180 a year and you don't even own the license.

Putting things in perspective, I'm sure there are other upgrade comparisons that would further support the obvious advantages of Bitwig's new model.

The main factor being that Bitwig at anytime during the year can release multiple major features at no extra cost, this is the part people have a hard time justifying and appropriating the overall value for the extra $40 a year, which is slightly less then 3 monthly Slate payments.

with Slate you don't have to pay 3xx bucks first or 159 bucks upgrade price. do you really want to discuss the term "license ownership"? oh dear! "license ownership" is a matter of trust.
and please, tell us, if you're working for Bitwig!
just do a survey and ask people, what they want. my 2cents

[SLiC]

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 9&t=477175

Survey!

[rod_zero]

The only ones hurting their bussines is BW itself with this new model.

Comparing Propellerhead Reason with Bitwig's upgrade plan.

Reason 7 March 12, 2013
>>> 18 months <<<
Reason 8 September 30, 2014
>>> 21 months <<<
Reason 9 June 21, 2016

Reason upgrade $129 for 1 major update
Bitwig upgrade $169 for at least 2 major updates
(unless Bitwig doesn't release one in over 12 months)

$40 extra to receive at least 1 extra major update with a 1/3rd of the wait time

Plus they avoided the subscription model so users could hold onto their perpetual licenses with the option to upgrade or not upgrade at anytime. Seems like a great new perspective and lens to look through.

Further comparison with something like Slate Digitals Everything Subscription model.

If you pay the $15 a month for 12 months it ends up being $180 a year and you don't even own the license.

Putting things in perspective, I'm sure there are other upgrade comparisons that would further support the obvious advantages of Bitwig's new model.

The main factor being that Bitwig at anytime during the year can release multiple major features at no extra cost, this is the part people have a hard time justifying and appropriating the overall value for the extra $40 a year, which is slightly less then 3 monthly Slate payments.

Still missing the point: their new model is more expensive than the previous and much more than their competition (Ableton).

[SLiC]

So what? If you don't think it's worth it don't upgrade or buy it.
Can we talk about the new features, not the cost, it's getting really dull.

[Daags]

Can we talk about the new features

Go ahead, there's nothing stopping you

not the cost

People will talk about whatever it is that interests them. You're not obliged to respond to or engage in topics that don't interest interest or concern you.

Welcome to the Internet.

[mellotronaut]

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 9&t=477175

Survey!

i'd like to have a survey about different price schemes, not this yes, maybe, no stuff. it's all about alternatives.

btw., i like the v.2 features a lot. this is, why i'd like to have a different price model. e.g.
initial price incl. one year major features and bugfixes and eternal "license ownership" 250€/upgrade 100€, upgrade from 8 Track 200€. every further year with major new features and bugfixes 100€, every further year with minor new features and bugfixes 50€ plus retrograde os compatibility guarantee for v.2

[justin3am]

So what? If you don't think it's worth it don't upgrade or buy it.
Can we talk about the new features, not the cost, it's getting really dull.

I've been playing with the new HW CV Output, HW CV Instrument and HW Clock Output devices quite a bit over the last few days and so far I'm very pleased.
The HW CV Output is a lot of fun, it's just a knob and and a list of available outputs. Turning the knob results in a DC voltage at the output. You can then modulate that knob with any of the Mod devices. I've had a lot of fun setting up a bunch of these devices in a layer and then using macros to control the CV output directly or the parameters of the Mod devices.
The Clock Output is a big deal for me because I use a lot of hardware sequencers. It has two outputs, one which is used to actually clock the sequencer and another which can be used to reset the sequencer. The reset is normally used to set the sequencer back to 1 when you press stop in the transport but it can also be used to define a step at which the sequence should restart, so you can have sequences which run at different lengths. Of course you can modulate the clock divisions for all sorts of madness. It has options for 1/96, 1/48 and 1/24 which are useful if you have drum machines which are expecting DinSync clock.

The CV Instrument has a Pitch output and a Gate output and can also be a container for other CV devices. The Pitch output has a range setting where you define the voltage range of the outputs on your DC coupled audio interface, so that you can get a signal which is scaled to 1v/oct. There is also a roote key setting so you can define which key is associated with 0v. The audio input works like the audio input on the normal HW Instrument device and it has a latency compensation setting. This is very nice as I had to create a HW FX device when using the Silent Way voice controller, anyway. With this configuration I don't need as many devices in the chain.

I'm also very happy with all the visual feedback improvements. For example, it's nice to have frequency analyzers on all of the EQ devices.

The New note processing devices are also a lot of fun.

The Bitwig 2.0 Alphas have been very stable in my opinion. I was able to complete a project without encountering any crashes. I have high hopes that once people get their hands on 2.0, they will be very happy with the new features and improvements.

[SLiC]

So what? If you don't think it's worth it don't upgrade or buy it.
Can we talk about the new features, not the cost, it's getting really dull.

I've been playing with the new HW CV Output, HW CV Instrument and HW Clock Output devices quite a bit over the last few days and so far I'm very pleased.
The HW CV Output is a lot of fun, it's just a knob and and a list of available outputs. Turning the knob results in a DC voltage at the output. You can then modulate that knob with any of the Mod devices. I've had a lot of fun setting up a bunch of these devices in a layer and then using macros to control the CV output directly or the parameters of the Mod devices.
The Clock Output is a big deal for me because I use a lot of hardware sequencers. It has two outputs, one which is used to actually clock the sequencer and another which can be used to reset the sequencer. The reset is normally used to set the sequencer back to 1 when you press stop in the transport but it can also be used to define a step at which the sequence should restart, so you can have sequences which run at different lengths. Of course you can modulate the clock divisions for all sorts of madness. It has options for 1/96, 1/48 and 1/24 which are useful if you have drum machines which are expecting DinSync clock.

The CV Instrument has a Pitch output and a Gate output and can also be a container for other CV devices. The Pitch output has a range setting where you define the voltage range of the outputs on your DC coupled audio interface, so that you can get a signal which is scaled to 1v/oct. There is also a roote key setting so you can define which key is associated with 0v. The audio input works like the audio input on the normal HW Instrument device and it has a latency compensation setting. This is very nice as I had to create a HW FX device when using the Silent Way voice controller, anyway. With this configuration I don't need as many devices in the chain.

I'm also very happy with all the visual feedback improvements. For example, it's nice to have frequency analyzers on all of the EQ devices.

The New note processing devices are also a lot of fun.

The Bitwig 2.0 Alphas have been very stable in my opinion. I was able to complete a project without encountering any crashes. I have high hopes that once people get their hands on 2.0, they will be very happy with the new features and improvements.

Thank you, Very promising.

[Hink]

my apologies, I did indeed overlook something and did find hard evidence of the sockpuppet...he is gone...please forgive my still learning process when it comes to the ip addresses