KVR Audio

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:09 pm

We'll see with time, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:13 pm

noiseboyuk wrote:An expander (smaller footprint) and 76 / 88 key versions could be viable.

How many of the current EDM crop needs 7 octaves to express themselves?

noiseboyuk · Post by **noiseboyuk** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:22 pm

Numanoid wrote:
noiseboyuk wrote:An expander (smaller footprint) and 76 / 88 key versions could be viable.
How many of the current EDM crop needs 7 octaves to express themselves?

Not many, but there's still a) stage use and b) serious sample library users (and we absolutely don't all want weighted keys).

Anyway, with the extra real estate to get serious control on there, it would soon be lust-worthy for the edm set

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:24 pm

Considering how even the S25 controller costs quite a bit more than your usual 25-key controller (if we're going by the leaked prices, which I'm sure if not correct aren't too far off either), how much would a controller with more physical controls and displays and stuff AND weighted keys cost then?

Numanoid · Post by **Numanoid** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:32 pm

It's like the keyboardist in The Cure need 76 keys to play A C F D, kind of overkill

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnVldyH ... page#t=198

noiseboyuk · Post by **noiseboyuk** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:35 pm

EvilDragon wrote:Considering how even the S25 controller costs quite a bit more than your usual 25-key controller (if we're going by the leaked prices, which I'm sure if not correct aren't too far off either), how much would a controller with more physical controls and displays and stuff AND weighted keys cost then?

Deffo NOT weighted keys for me. There isn't a single decent quality semi-weighted 88 note on the market. Crazy.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:42 pm

That's because 88 keys aren't MEANT to be semi-weighted!

BDeep · Post by **BDeep** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:42 pm

hermbot wrote:What do people hope to see in an update for Massive?

Stereo throughout (ie, oscs, filters, etc).

noiseboyuk · Post by **noiseboyuk** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:52 pm

EvilDragon wrote:That's because 88 keys aren't MEANT to be semi-weighted!

In 2014, I disagree. Composers want 88 keys, not just for piano but for the whole range of other instruments, and also keyswitches. Only a fraction of that time is spent playing a piano sound, when the weighted action is appropriate. It's a burden on violins, harps, drums, synths etc. Obviously some do want weighted keys and they are well served - those of us who want semi-weighted are only offered cheap and badly made, it seems.

Anyway, surely this tangent has gone on long enough - no matter how much I and others might want it, it ain't happening.

Gamma-UT · Post by **Gamma-UT** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:06 pm

noiseboyuk wrote:
EvilDragon wrote:That's because 88 keys aren't MEANT to be semi-weighted!
In 2014, I disagree. Composers want 88 keys, not just for piano but for the whole range of other instruments, and also keyswitches. Only a fraction of that time is spent playing a piano sound, when the weighted action is appropriate. It's a burden on violins, harps, drums, synths etc. Obviously some do want weighted keys and they are well served - those of us who want semi-weighted are only offered cheap and badly made, it seems.

Anyway, surely this tangent has gone on long enough - no matter how much I and others might want it, it ain't happening.

At the risk of continuing this for too long, does it make too much of a difference to put a 25-key unit over a regular 76-key semi-weighted and just transpose it down a few octaves to get you into the keyswitch range? I can see people using the Komplete keys on stage simply sitting on top of a Nord or something just for the knobs so they still have a 'decent' keybed to play on.

I can see the point of an 88-key semi-weighted unit but without much of a live-performance market for it, the manufacturers are faced with salami slicing an already small market.

loachm · Post by **loachm** » Fri Aug 29, 2014 10:16 pm

...I agree with some here that more knobs would be cooler, but then again, how may knobs can you control at a time? With some well laid-out controller pages it shouldn't be a problem. However, I'm curious how this unit communicates with the plug-ins, as I expect that you'll have instant control over all NI plug-ins (otherwise these keyboards wouldn't make much sense). Will we see something like Kore? Unless that Arp, for instance, is running from the HW there has got to be some host plug-in solution involved? Or have NI done something similar to Novation's Automap? Looking at the controls it seems to me that it'll feature some host application...

PS. ...why the fuss about the Kontakt libraries and Reaktor ensembles? Kontakt and Reaktor are NI'S flagship products (they made it abundantly clear) and, personally, I wouldn't need much more than these two...

Breeze · Post by **Breeze** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 4:17 am

If this controller isn't isn't optional, it'll practically be a dongle. Hopefully it'll bring more to the table than the many MIDI controllers already available, but I'd be really surprised. It's likely to be NI-centric, and not very useable for much else.

(While OT, sorry but I'm pretty passionate about 88 non-weighted or semi-weighted: I totally disagree with the view that it HAS to be weighted. 88-keys is eminently practical for anyone using many multi-sampled libraries where key switches are tucked into the extreme of the keyboard to allow for a useable playable range in the middle. Transposing a limited-range 61 or 76-key keyboard just isn't practical enough (I have a 76-key: it's still a total PITA and workflow killer). And weighted keys are just not practical or comfortable to play for most instruments outside of pianos (have you ever felt a B3 keyboard?).

So any manufacturers reading this: please make us a solid 88-key unweighted or semi-weighted MIDI controller keyboard with a smooth continuous velocity output, with controllers on the left (not close to the output jacks!), and with channel AND polyphonic aftertouch. And if you build it so we can implement MIDI 2.0 with an eventual hardware addon, I believe you'd have a winner on your hands.)

cryophonik · Post by **cryophonik** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 4:29 am

loachm wrote:PS. ...why the fuss about the Kontakt libraries and Reaktor ensembles? Kontakt and Reaktor are NI'S flagship products (they made it abundantly clear)...

I would add Maschine as a flagship product. I think (hope) that these new controllers are a step in the same direction, where the hardware controller has very tight integration with NI's software instruments.

hibidy · Post by **hibidy** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 4:41 am

I had kore. I ended up selling it because it was a hassle at the time to get cubase focused to where the controller actually control what I wanted. I don't use the maschine controller because I still have to jump through a crapload of hoops to be able to use the knobs/buttons it has with a host.

For those that are excited about this, I sure hope that it's somehow different. If you have to keep refocusing and mousing around you might as well use what you have

Breeze · Post by **Breeze** » Sat Aug 30, 2014 4:45 am

cryophonik wrote:I would add Maschine as a flagship product. I think (hope) that these new controllers are a step in the same direction, where the hardware controller has very tight integration with NI's software instruments.

My first reaction was that they're about to shove Maschine down every Komplete user's throat (I know it sounds bad.. but it was my first reaction). But maybe they're introducing some beefed up version of the Kore concept. Now that could be very interesting!

Komplete 10 Date - Oct. 1 2014