LinnThesizer - a synth concept

[TigerBalm]

Just wanted to chime in and say I agree with your gripes about synthesizers Roger. I used Equator2 with my LinnStrument. I think Equator2 falls into the category of “subtractive synth in steroids”. It has 6 should sources, dozens of modulators, 2 filters, routing options, and effects galore. The presets are great but I dare not edit them because they’re so complex. I think there’s definitely room to design a more musical experience.

[t-IB]

If “LinnThesizer” did exist, I might not even use it because I know all the details of synths. The intent is to make it easier for people without my technical skills.

There's something to be said about having something instant so the focus is on playing - I bought a cheap dx7 to practice piano on when living overseas and couldn't stop tweaking the damn thing! Anyway, if you ever make it, I'll buy it!

[Roger_Linn]

I wouldn’t make a synth like what I’m proposing because I’m not in the software business. I was merely describing a concept for purposes of discussion of the idea.

[pdxindy]

Just wanted to chime in and say I agree with your gripes about synthesizers Roger. I used Equator2 with my LinnStrument. I think Equator2 falls into the category of “subtractive synth in steroids”. It has 6 should sources, dozens of modulators, 2 filters, routing options, and effects galore. The presets are great but I dare not edit them because they’re so complex. I think there’s definitely room to design a more musical experience.

that is why lots of synths provide macros so that users can meaningfully tweak presets without having to dig deep into sound design.

[t-IB]

I wouldn’t make a synth like what I’m proposing because I’m not in the software business. I was merely describing a concept for purposes of discussion of the idea.

It's been a useful thing to consider here - think I've figured how to set up the continuumini in the same way I had my axoloti core running, with a load of start points set up from which I can CC control key parameters via the linnstrument faders. Win!

[jsterne]

Seems like what you’re proposing Roger is large a set of parameters and an interface for them. I am guessing this is already possible in software, though I wouldn’t hazard to try it. I agree that expressing curves make a huge difference in programming sounds for MPE.

[Roger_Linn]

Yes, of course the devil is in the details but the goal is to for a musician to quickly realize any existing or imagined sound without technical knowledge.

[Michael L]

Perhaps shift focus from synth design to controller mapping, and apply the idea of an isomorphic keyboard to synth parameters, so for the left hand five different types of instruments (e.g., strings, woodwinds, brass, keys, percussion) are located on the 5 leftmost columns of the keyboard so a hand can choose up to 5 types and 8 variations (? acoustic > synthetic) based on the rows; a particular chord pattern is associated with sonic complexity, on a continuum from 1 column x multiple rows), to 5 different columns x rows; and each note within a chord pattern is associated with 5 parameters of that sound (envelope and timbre) through the 5 axes of MPE touch so each finger can modify different parameters of that sound, and while the left hand does all this the right hand plays -- I call it Multiparameter Polydextrous Expression

[wakyct]

I had a random thought recently while watching a demo of the newish Vector synth (a kind of extreme wave morphing synth), then messing around with four tracks of Surge in a daw, and remembered this thread.

Since Surge is an official Linnstrument synth, how viable would it be to create some kind of custom UI that just used Surge instruments as the sound sources of the Linnthesizer? I imagine you'd have to have some spec/standard by which you'd create the Surge patches, and I don't know if you'd hit the limitations of working with a vst patch (with just the patch parameters available for modulation). But as I don't have much experience with daws and vst instruments, I'm seeking the wisdom of the forum here.

[Roger_Linn]

Thank you for your thought, wakyct. This topic was not intended to produce a product but rather to stimulate thought and discussion. I’m not in the computer software business so it’s not something I’d be interested in doing. Also, Surge is very powerful but not in the way I was describing.

That said, in one of my monthly newsletters a few months back, I including the following link to a neural synthesizer of a few years back that did a pretty good job of producing a new instrument by morphing between two or more instrument samples:

https://experiments.withgoogle.com/ai/sound-maker/view/

It’s very simple but is an example of what I was shooting for— intuitively creating a new timbre from existing timbres, thereby eliminating the need to learn different and unintuitive engineering methods (subtractive, FM, additive, granular, etc.) for each imagined sound.

[flipcoder]

Great concept, Roger! This would be fantastic in a floor pedal version as well with buttons for changing presets and a pedal input for modifying parameters in real time.

I started experimenting with a MIDI pedalboard (FCB1010) with the linnstrument and it's been fun. I've only scratched the surface with it but I think it opens up some interesting possibilities.

[Tj Shredder]

That said, in one of my monthly newsletters a few months back, I including the following link to a neural synthesizer of a few years back that did a pretty good job of producing a new instrument by morphing between two or more instrument samples:

https://experiments.withgoogle.com/ai/sound-maker/view/

It’s very simple but is an example of what I was shooting for— intuitively creating a new timbre from existing timbres, thereby eliminating the need to learn different and unintuitive engineering methods (subtractive, FM, additive, granular, etc.) for each imagined sound.

I had great results with Mawf by feeding it with a simple expressive MPE controlled sound:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvqZecXynS8
Its from the same research group. The number of timbres is limited, but it sounds great for me. The synthesizing version was boring compared to the fx version fed with an expressive synth sound…
On the other hand AI will only be able to produce sounds its trained on. Nothing really new to be expected, but the expressiveness is there already…

[Roger_Linn]

Hi TJ,

I wasn't aware of MAWF, so thank you for posting this. I've just applied for the beta but it isn't yet available in the U.S. Hopefully it will be soon.

[Tj Shredder]

You might also look at this:
https://magenta.tensorflow.org/ddsp-vst

[Roger_Linn]

I wasn't aware of DDSP either, and will try it out. Thanks, TJ.