Synapse Audio Minimoog emulation "The Legend" for VST/AU and RE released!

[Ingonator]

Having a certain range where the hardware modwhel starts working does not really seem to be a good idea IMO. IF the Modwheel input from the hardware works it should work trough the whole range

Well, my suggestion would be to add a switch (near to the MW fader in the GUI) that either lets the Modwheel work normally (default state) or blocks the Modwheel input of the hardware. It should be also possible to save the setting with a preset file. If someone needs teh Modwheel input it should be also possible to "unblock" it with that switch.

Not sure how simple it would be to implement this. Technically this seems to be a "MIDI input filter".

[ENV1]

I too would vote for an OFF/ON switch whose state is saved into the preset because with some presets you absolutely do not want any change in the set MW value whatsoever.

It would provide the necessary kind of protection against accidental value changes whilst at the same time the MW could still be used normally in presets that were designed to use it dynamically.

Best solution, IMO.

[zvenx]

Maybe I am misunderstanding the issue, but doesn't the DAW take care of this?
At least in Cubendo there is a chase midi cc/automation I believe. You can set it to either look at the current modwheel setting on the controller and use that, or ignore the current value of the controller and only pay attention to it when that controller is moved.

I believe.

rsp

[ENV1]

I have a lot of VCO3->VCO1/2 'FM' presets on the Arturia minimoog where the precise position of the MW is crucial to the sound. (One little nudge and everything is shot to hell.) I therefore agree that a MW-Ignore feature would be a good thing to have on synths with this kind of architecture.

I agree, though I think it would make more sense to define a range for the mod wheel so you could set its full range from something like 20-70% This way you could still use the modulation wheel to your heart's content, but it's resting amount could be arbitrary.

I think i understand what you mean, but it wouldnt really help with the problem of accidental value alterations especially when you have a board whose MW snaps back to center. (Unless i misunderstood you after all.)

[Teksonik]

How about MIDI Learn per knob (including the modulation wheel), which has been asked for earlier - wouldn't that solve the issue? Then one could just assign the modulation wheel to a different MIDI CC.

Richard

Would that be remembered on a per patch basis ? One patch you want the MW to control the MW Slider the next patch you don't want it controlled. Really I think a simple switch on the back panel under Modulation "Disable Mod Wheel" would be the simplest solution for this issue but I would like to see Midi Learn from within The Legend.

[Teksonik]

It IMHO does not make much sense to take a MIDI controller, MIDI filter whatsoever to "paralyse" the ModWheel into whatever position.

Sure it makes sense. If you have the modulation set just the way you want it in the patch any change will cause the patch to not sound as intended. The change could be subtle but it could also completely fork up the patch. Like I said a simple per patch switch to disable the MW would solve this......or another LFO that could be assigned at will.

[Teksonik]

I too would vote for an OFF/ON switch whose state is saved into the preset because with some presets you absolutely do not want any change in the set MW value whatsoever.

It would provide the necessary kind of protection against accidental value changes whilst at the same time the MW could still be used normally in presets that were designed to use it dynamically.

Best solution, IMO.

+1

[Teksonik]

Well, my suggestion would be to add a switch (near to the MW fader in the GUI)

It should be on the back panel under Modulation. Plenty of Room, just move the Shape settings over and down a bit. You could have a small red light over the MW Slider showing whether it's active or not.

[zerocrossing]

How about MIDI Learn per knob (including the modulation wheel), which has been asked for earlier - wouldn't that solve the issue? Then one could just assign the modulation wheel to a different MIDI CC.

Richard

You could also add a range parameter that clamps the effect of the ModWheel. I think Dave Smith did that in the OB-6 so that the modulation starts at a min value. Then, ModWheel brings it up to the max value set by the patch designer.

This way the patch designer can limit the modulation amount within the musical boundaries it's meant to be used.

Is it possible to segment the modwheel, like assign to MW 0-50 range, or MW 50-100 range. Any synths do this?

Well, the "point of interest" where the right amount of modulation is hit varies from preset to preset. Therefore it makes sense to add the constraint to the plug-in - to make it save with preset. It IMHO does not make much sense to take a MIDI controller, MIDI filter whatsoever to "paralyse" the ModWheel into whatever position.

Thing is, most classical Minimoog sounds need to be played with ModWheel, most of the time to add Vibrato as means of expression. So I think in general ModWheel should stay ModWheel. Hence I think the best thing to do is to add a parameter to wether fix or constrain the ModWheel, only if necessary.

I guess MIDI Learn is fine if it's per preset. But that also means every preset designer will save their "non-ModWheel" patches with whatever other MIDI controller - that could easily become a mess. If MIDI Learn is global, it'll be tedious to flip back and forth with ModWheel for whenever ModWheel is needed. The third possibility is MIDI Learn with project/song, but that requires action on the user's side, and once the value is changed, how would the user know to MIDI Learn the wheel away?

Plus, practically, MIDI Learn is done by selecting the UI control and wiggling the knob/wheel/slider. Thus it instantly changes the parameter, which is exactly what is meant to be prevented

Therefore my suggestion goes to a parameter/constraint done by preset designer - less work for the end user, less chance for hiccups.

- U

@Richard: Isn't it funny how sometimes the most simple things pose the biggest challenge...

I think about UI all the time (as a UI designer) and it would be pretty easy to implement from a graphics standpoint. No need for a button or different modes. Just a "slot" with two fader handles set into it. If you drag one to the top and one to the bottom, it functions as the default Model D modwheel. If you want it parked, bring both handles to the point you want to park it so they butt up against each other. For instance, of you brought them both to the bottom and then started dragging the bottom handel up, it would move the top up as well and it would act kind of like it acts now. But, if you still want some modwheel action, drag the top handel up and define the modwheel range. If you really wanted to get tricky, you could add a flip button so that your modwheel behaved in the opposite manner. Moving the modwheel up would decrease modulation amount.

[Teksonik]

No need for a button or different modes. Just a "slot" with two fader handles set into it. If you drag one to the top and one to the bottom, it functions as the default Model D modwheel. If you want it parked, bring both handles to the point you want to park it so they butt up against each other. For instance, of you brought them both to the bottom and then started dragging the bottom handel up, it would move the top up as well and it would act kind of like it acts now. But, if you still want some modwheel action, drag the top handel up and define the modwheel range. If you really wanted to get tricky, you could add a flip button so that your modwheel behaved in the opposite manner. Moving the modwheel up would decrease modulation amount.

You really think all that is easier than a simple switch ? Don't over complicate it.........

[Touch The Universe]

How about MIDI Learn per knob (including the modulation wheel), which has been asked for earlier - wouldn't that solve the issue? Then one could just assign the modulation wheel to a different MIDI CC.

Richard

You could also add a range parameter that clamps the effect of the ModWheel. I think Dave Smith did that in the OB-6 so that the modulation starts at a min value. Then, ModWheel brings it up to the max value set by the patch designer.

This way the patch designer can limit the modulation amount within the musical boundaries it's meant to be used.

Is it possible to segment the modwheel, like assign to MW 0-50 range, or MW 50-100 range. Any synths do this?

I thought every (or most) synth does via the mod matrix.
Dune2 f.e.
But it's often a bit of too much tabbing.
I find the "dials" of one of my iOS synths great.
You can assign for every parameter a min. and max. value in %. Then you could go further and modulate the min. or max. with another min. and max. value etc.
You also can set those things to modwheel and whatever....

How would you do this in Dune 2? I don't see any option to define minimum or maximum.

It does have a vel>100 option which a parameter assigned would only trigger the quicker played notes.

Would be cool if there would be MW<50 and MW>50, not necessarily in this synth (it doesn't even have a matrix), for getting really creative with the MW. Won't derail this thread anymore

[sacer]

i wasn' t thinking that i need another modelD after minimonsta, diva and monark, but this one sounds realy fascinating and i prefer the legend over monark. I would realy appreciate an arpeggiator.
Sounddesigner have more possibilities, and i like to buy soundsets with sequences and arp sounds.
In Diva i was also very happy for this long waited feature and a lot of 1.3 soundsets.

[Elektronisch]

I have a question, is it a bug or is it intended to make that when playing in poly mode secondary keys do not hold release if you release the key?

[cytospur]

Well, my suggestion would be to add a switch (near to the MW fader in the GUI)

It should be on the back panel under Modulation. Plenty of Room, just move the Shape settings over and down a bit. You could have a small red light over the MW Slider showing whether it's active or not.

There's plenty of space on the front panel for a small switch. Personally, I'd have a reset to original position button and keep the full range of the mod wheel functionality available at all times.

[AnX]

That wouldnt work on a sprung MW, as soon as you click reset the MW would send a zero cc.