need some advice on setting up...

[chaosWyrM]

hi everyone...

so since ive started making music ive been just using software. when i first started in the late 90's and before i knew anything at all (i still dont know much), i acquired a couple of hardware synths. a yamaha dx200 and a virus indigo. naturally...since i didnt know what i was doing...these things were far beyond my ability to actually use them. so...theyve spent the last 15 years basically just living in their boxes in my closet.

my "studio" has until now consisted of me and my computer and my novation 25sl mkii just sitting on my desk. well no more! i will be moving with my girlfriend and my daughter to a house in a couple of months, and in that house is a room that will be my new home studio. yay

so my question is just how do i connect my hardware up? i know i know...there are lots of how tos and whatnot...but i find them quite confusing. a lot of people have a lot of answers for all kinds of situations, so i figured the best bet for me is to explain exactly what i have...and what i want to do and see if anyone can help.

so heres what i have (theres a few more hardwares now that a friend gave to me):

computer (with my daw on it)
novation 25sl mkii

access virus indigo 2 ***see note below
yamaha dx200
korg electribe a
red sound systems darkstar

*** the indigo is "broken" insofar as i can not use the keyboard on it (so its really just a fancy looking virus b)...the synth works perfectly though and just needs to be used with a controller.

here is what i want to do:

be able to control all hardware with the novation
hear and record everything through the computer/daw

what do i need to get to do this and how does it get all wired up?

again, im aware that there are tons and tons of instructions and similar questions out there...please understand that that fact is exactly what is confusing me so much. this is a new area for me and i find it a bit overwhelming. i have even considered not even bothering and just selling all my hardware...but i really do want to at least give it a shot.

thanks in advance.

[tapper mike]

House, child?

Lock it away or say goodbye.

Start with what you have and maybe a zoom R16 mixer.
http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/r16

That way you aren't constantly unplugging and plugging in to record your hardware. It's no latency as a 16 track (8 at a time) hardware mixer/recorder. It also doubles as a soundcard / software mixer for your daw. That way you aren't constantly unplugging one thing to plug something else into your computer.

You also might want to consider a midi splitter box like this one.
http://www.guitarcenter.com/MIDI-Soluti ... 1154391.gc

[rockstar_not]

Your novation probably can take care of MIDI interface duty for you, but I'm not sure about how it would work with that as the MIDI interface, and the Zoom R16 as the audio interface. I've always done audio & midi through the same USB interface; not sure about splitting up that duty across two different devices. Anyone else want to chime in here?

[chaosWyrM]

House, child?

Lock it away or say goodbye.

Start with what you have and maybe a zoom R16 mixer.
http://www.zoom.co.jp/products/r16

That way you aren't constantly unplugging and plugging in to record your hardware. It's no latency as a 16 track (8 at a time) hardware mixer/recorder. It also doubles as a soundcard / software mixer for your daw. That way you aren't constantly unplugging one thing to plug something else into your computer.

You also might want to consider a midi splitter box like this one.
http://www.guitarcenter.com/MIDI-Soluti ... 1154391.gc

thnx for the reply...at first glance...the r16 looks like way overkill and subsequently price. i dont need any of the control surface capabilities as i already have the novation. im also pretty well set on effects and such so i dont really need those functions either. as for the recording functions...i was planning on just doing that through my computer.

with that said...could i just get a simple mixer and midi splitter box?

or am i not understanding something?

[chaosWyrM]

Your novation probably can take care of MIDI interface duty for you, but I'm not sure about how it would work with that as the MIDI interface, and the Zoom R16 as the audio interface. I've always done audio & midi through the same USB interface; not sure about splitting up that duty across two different devices. Anyone else want to chime in here?

so...is one usb interface all i need to connect all these things to the novation and the computer? also can you suggest one you think is decent so i can take a look?

thnx

[chaosWyrM]

i found this. they make it look simple, but i dont see where the actual audio is going. am i to assume that the audio outs would need to all go into a mixer and then out from the mixer to my sound card?

lol...im already confused.



-edited to make image viewable again.

[BertKoor]

here is what i want to do:
be able to control all hardware with the novation

Just with the Novation controller? Not also with midi sequences from your DAW / Host ?? Not that it makes much difference, technically, but it gives you more fine control. Record a part in MIDI, then edit it further without having to redo the whole part. Ofcourse you need either a seperate USB Midi device (costs a few tenners) or a Midi port in the audio interface (most have that)

Some of your synths have a Midi Thru connector. That gives you the option to daisy-chain them so you don't need a Midi splitter: Midi OUT of controller (or DAW) goes to Midi IN of first synth, Midi Thru of that synth goes to Midi IN of the second synth, Midi Thru of second synth goes to Midi IN of third synth, etc etc. A synth without Thru can go last in the chain, and some synths have config options to set the Midi OUT port to function as THRU as well.

MIDI has 16 channels on a single wire. You can set each synth to listen to one specific channel only, and by varying the channel number (on either the controller or in your DAW) you can select which synth will respond without having to unplug/replug anything.

hear and record everything through the computer/daw

A small mixer would be cool (connect directly to your existing sound card) or an audio interface with sufficient inputs. You had four synths, if each has stereo outputs you'd need 8 (mono) channels at least.

If you now use the bog-standard integrated soundchip of the PC, then getting a proper musicians audio interfaces has some bonuses: low-latency native ASIO drivers, direct monitoring (inputs go directly to outputs), an extra Midi port, etc.

If you work with just one synth at a time, you can get by without a multi-channel mixer of interface. Saves hundreds...

i found this. they make it look simple, but i dont see where the actual audio is going. am i to assume that the audio outs would need to all go into a mixer and then out from the mixer to my sound card?

lol...im already confused.

You're right, in that picture the audio is not going anywhere. That pic just shows one Midi interface connected to two synths, each with in & out going to/from the midi interface (and thus to/from the computer)

[tapper mike]

latency can be a bitch with midi thru daisy chained that's why I suggested a splitter box.

[rockstar_not]

The novation has two different MIDI outs, one set has a thru connector. He could to a 'star' rather than daisy chain and likely be fine there.

But there's no audio input happening in the current setup. The R16 looked interesting, but the fact that it's usb audio, and the novation would be USB midi - could that case interrupt and other difficulties? I've always used a combo audio/midi device - right now I have a Focusrite Scarlett 18i8.

[chaosWyrM]

here is what i want to do:
be able to control all hardware with the novation

Just with the Novation controller? Not also with midi sequences from your DAW / Host ?? Not that it makes much difference, technically, but it gives you more fine control. Record a part in MIDI, then edit it further without having to redo the whole part. Ofcourse you need either a seperate USB Midi device (costs a few tenners) or a Midi port in the audio interface (most have that)

Some of your synths have a Midi Thru connector. That gives you the option to daisy-chain them so you don't need a Midi splitter: Midi OUT of controller (or DAW) goes to Midi IN of first synth, Midi Thru of that synth goes to Midi IN of the second synth, Midi Thru of second synth goes to Midi IN of third synth, etc etc. A synth without Thru can go last in the chain, and some synths have config options to set the Midi OUT port to function as THRU as well.

MIDI has 16 channels on a single wire. You can set each synth to listen to one specific channel only, and by varying the channel number (on either the controller or in your DAW) you can select which synth will respond without having to unplug/replug anything.

yes...i would want to be able to use the daw/host to control them as well. i didnt mention it because i was thinking that if the novation is connected to the host/daw and to the synths that would make the synths controllable with the daw by default.

am i mistaken in that thinking?...or is that why you said it doesnt make much difference technically?

[chaosWyrM]

so would this work then? i apologize in advance for my terrible photoshop skills



i would need to get the midi interface and mixer, all the other stuff is what i have already.

so unless im still missing something...this doesnt look that difficult to me.

-edit: the midi interface and mixer are just place holder images...not exact products i was thinking of getting. i just wanted pics of a 10 channel mixer and an 8x8 midi interface.

[rockstar_not]

Your Novation has 2 independent midi outputs. There is very likely no need for the MOTU type device. You can put two devices off of the first midi out port, and the other two devices chained off of the 2nd. If you want to control them all via MIDI all the time from the DAW, then it might be necessary to do a midi hub, but very likely you are going to record audio off of the hardware, correct?

How are you planning on getting the audio into the computer?

[chaosWyrM]

Your Novation has 2 independent midi outputs. There is very likely no need for the MOTU type device. You can put two devices off of the first midi out port, and the other two devices chained off of the 2nd. If you want to control them all via MIDI all the time from the DAW, then it might be necessary to do a midi hub, but very likely you are going to record audio off of the hardware, correct?

How are you planning on getting the audio into the computer?

yes i would like to be able to control everything via midi from the daw.

i was thinking i could use one of those y shaped 1/4 mono to mini stereo jacks and put it right into the line in on my sound card. would that not work?

[rockstar_not]

Your Novation has 2 independent midi outputs. There is very likely no need for the MOTU type device. You can put two devices off of the first midi out port, and the other two devices chained off of the 2nd. If you want to control them all via MIDI all the time from the DAW, then it might be necessary to do a midi hub, but very likely you are going to record audio off of the hardware, correct?

How are you planning on getting the audio into the computer?

yes i would like to be able to control everything via midi from the daw.

i was thinking i could use one of those y shaped 1/4 mono to mini stereo jacks and put it right into the line in on my sound card. would that not work?

While it might work, the input amplifier on the soundcard is not designed for pro-audio, and you will be sorely underwhelmed at the result. If this thread was turned into a poll as to the percentage of KVR members that rely solely on the in-built sound of their laptop or desktop, whether Apple or PC, I think you will find it to be less than 1%.

[chaosWyrM]

ah...i didnt make this part clear...im not using on-board sound. i have a creative x-fi xtreme gamer fatal1ty pro sound card.... i know its an older card, and wasnt ever that good in the first place...but ive never really had any complaints about it. ive never had any problems with it sound wise or running lots of vstis and effects.