DUNE 3 is now available!!

[anomandaris1]

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Not a matter of belief but a simple fact that a lot of very successful albums selling in the millions were done in common twelve-tone equal temperament

I don't have anything against Microtuning being added to Dune 3 although I have no use for it but I do find the "oooh I'm so superior because I like micro-tuning" attitude I've seen in recent times to be really annoying.

Well, well; actual 12 equal exists only in digital midi synths (good luck perfectly tuning acoustic instruments - and some of them go out of tune during the performance..).
And almost noone buys music today (considering youtube and streaming services exist); and the most popular tunes/artists are (most of the time, especially in current state of the industry) garbage in terms of musicality, but the performer look is OK and they have interesting media image, so popularity and commercial success have little to do with music itself.
The person that may use microtuning may not be superior, but the sound may be (it depends on the choice of timbre and tuning - I have yet to hear someone crying from pleasant emotions when listening to midi orchestral music, but it happens all the time in orchestral halls; while tuning is not the only factor, it is one of them; the rest of them are probably the actual performance - with tasteful vibrato and expressive pitch bends - and hall acoustics).
Even if we ignore various retuning that are too close to 12 equal, microtuning options can enable completely original (to Western ears) sounding experimental or ethnic music.
People that limit themselves to only 12 equal - have no idea how to use microtuning; or don't use it only because noone else in their environment does it (many Asian and African people would probably preferred NOT to limit their music to 12 equal)

[AnX]

the most popular tunes/artists are (most of the time, especially in current state of the industry) garbage in terms of musicality, but the performer look is OK and they have interesting media image, so popularity and commercial success have little to do with music itself.

the snobbery is strong in this one

[anomandaris1]

the most popular tunes/artists are (most of the time, especially in current state of the industry) garbage in terms of musicality, but the performer look is OK and they have interesting media image, so popularity and commercial success have little to do with music itself.

the snobbery is strong in this one

What snobbery - can't you go to Billboard top 100 and check for yourself? Is this the apex of 200-300 years of common practice musical education, wow
It makes sense that in Guantanamo Bay they were using mostly such music (also children songs) for breaking the spirit of the prisoners; they found there that atonal/avantgarde music doesn't have such effects, probably because, despite it is considered as "sounding bad" (acoustic dissonance + complexity), it is actually interesting musically.

[surreal]

I live in South "Africa" and microtuning is moot. .. it does not exist in our music culture

[anomandaris1]

I live in South "Africa" and microtuning is moot. .. it does not exist in our music culture

Let me use an analogy: in Europe noone uses triple and compound meters anymore (at least not in popular music), but this doesn't mean that there doesn't exist rich history, associated with such types of music compositions.
I don't know about South Africa, but some aspects of original African music cultures have been documented and researched, so it may be only your ignorance or regional phenomena (I think that only examples for microtonal counterpoint and polyphony are also from this continent - so, only in Africa and Europe were observed such musical developments; all around the world singing was mostly in heterophonic or homophonic textures).

[AnX]

the most popular tunes/artists are (most of the time, especially in current state of the industry) garbage in terms of musicality, but the performer look is OK and they have interesting media image, so popularity and commercial success have little to do with music itself.

the snobbery is strong in this one

What snobbery - can't you go to Billboard top 100 and check for yourself? Is this the apex of 200-300 years of common practice musical education, wow
It makes sense that in Guantanamo Bay they were using mostly such music (also children songs) for breaking the spirit of the prisoners; they found there that atonal/avantgarde music doesn't have such effects, probably because, despite it is considered as "sounding bad" (acoustic dissonance + complexity), it is actually interesting musically.

what snobbery?

oh boy

[BONES]

I have yet to hear someone crying from pleasant emotions when listening to midi orchestral music, but it happens all the time in orchestral halls;

And precisely how many performances of "midi (sic) orchestral music" have you attended? And, for the record, I've been to dozens of orchestra performances and I've never seen anyone crying.

microtuning options can enable completely original (to Western ears) sounding experimental or ethnic music.

Or, as we like to call it, rubbish. Unlistenable rubbish, in fact.

People that limit themselves to only 12 equal - have no idea how to use microtuning; or don't use it only because noone else in their environment does it (many Asian and African people would probably preferred NOT to limit their music to 12 equal)

What? This is only half a thought. What were you trying to say? Honestly, if this is the best you have, you're not winning anyone over. Most of only use 4/4 time signature, so what? Yes, there are plenty of other time signatures but 4/4 works so that's what we use. Same with tuning - whatever it is that works by default is all we need to do what we want to do. I for instance, have no interest in African music or any other form of cultural appropriation, so equal temperament works and I use it. Someone on another thread suggested all our music could benefit from using microtuning but when I asked him to provide some examples, I got nothing so, in the absence of any evidence that I shouldn't, I'll keep doing what I've been doing.

it is actually interesting musically.

What does that even mean? Music isn't meant to be interesting, it is meant to connect with you emotionally.

Let me use an analogy: in Europe noone uses triple and compound meters anymore (at least not in popular music), but this doesn't mean that there doesn't exist rich history, associated with such types of music compositions.

So what? Who cares about any rich history? Why should it influence what I do today?

[Cinebient]

Not sure what bullshit is going on here but i would welcome microtuning. That‘s all. I like Dune 3 without but it would be a nice extra.

[DJ Warmonger]

I'd also like to see microtuning... in order to finally try it out.

I own a plenty of synths, but only Serum and Harmor actually supports this feature. And these are not the first pick for classic, musical sounds.

[Cinebient]

It is not only useful for classic but i also like it for drones, soundscapes which just can more easy create certain moods which i cannot do within the western scale. Then there are harmonies and stuff which works just with other tunings. Then Dune 3 is a very complex synth with audio rate modulations. Here it is also interesting to experiment with if you f.e. use an OSC to modulate something at audio rate and you have different steps as a semi-tone in western tuning. There are 1000 things more which can be useful.
Of course a lot people do not care and do not need that and that is fine. But having that option is absolute a big plus for me. But as usual some people cannot imagine behind their own head.

[Teksonik]

the most popular tunes/artists are (most of the time, especially in current state of the industry) garbage in terms of musicality,

Thank you for proving my point about snobbery......

Someone said you need microtuning to make "real music". I simply pointed out the fact that millions of albums were sold without any microtuning at all (no I'm not talking about out of tune guitars etc). Sorry but those are the facts.

But as usual some people cannot imagine behind their own head.

Thank you for proving my point about snobbery......

My first exposure to alternative tunings occurred in the 1980's with an OS Disk for the Ensoniq Mirage that provided such functionality. I quickly discovered that I have no use for them and that holds true today.

http://jawknee.com/Mirage/UPWARD/multitempdocs.html

Like I said I have nothing against adding MT support to Dune 3 if for no other reason to stop people from whining about it.......

[AnX]

it's down to Rich, and it's not in anything he has ever made, so....

[vurt]

I have yet to hear someone crying from pleasant emotions when listening to midi orchestral music, but it happens all the time in orchestral halls;

And precisely how many performances of "midi (sic) orchestral music" have you attended? And, for the record, I've been to dozens of orchestra performances and I've never seen anyone crying.

microtuning options can enable completely original (to Western ears) sounding experimental or ethnic music.

Or, as we like to call it, rubbish. Unlistenable rubbish, in fact.

People that limit themselves to only 12 equal - have no idea how to use microtuning; or don't use it only because noone else in their environment does it (many Asian and African people would probably preferred NOT to limit their music to 12 equal)

What? This is only half a thought. What were you trying to say? Honestly, if this is the best you have, you're not winning anyone over. Most of only use 4/4 time signature, so what? Yes, there are plenty of other time signatures but 4/4 works so that's what we use. Same with tuning - whatever it is that works by default is all we need to do what we want to do. I for instance, have no interest in African music or any other form of cultural appropriation, so equal temperament works and I use it. Someone on another thread suggested all our music could benefit from using microtuning but when I asked him to provide some examples, I got nothing so, in the absence of any evidence that I shouldn't, I'll keep doing what I've been doing.

it is actually interesting musically.

What does that even mean? Music isn't meant to be interesting, it is meant to connect with you emotionally.

Let me use an analogy: in Europe noone uses triple and compound meters anymore (at least not in popular music), but this doesn't mean that there doesn't exist rich history, associated with such types of music compositions.

So what? Who cares about any rich history? Why should it influence what I do today?

far be it from me to tell you how to do your job.
but i believe the word you are looking for was "idiot"

[Dombaeb]

Or, as we like to call it, rubbish. Unlistenable rubbish, in fact.

What does that even mean? Music isn't meant to be interesting, it is meant to connect with you emotionally.

I need to share with you that Indian music culture, one of the richest, fulfilled and innovative on all sides music culture in history, using Ragas. Raga has no direct translation to concepts in the classical European or Western music tradition because of the concept - total freedom of experimentation. Actually, each Raga is a unique scale and a bunch of motives that affect the emotions. That's how you can use microtuning.

You may don't want to make "ethnic experimental rubbish" but you need to know that some of the most sacred (by emotional response) instruments like Vina, were designed to be microtonal.

So, like it or not...

[Teksonik]

it's down to Rich, and it's not in anything he has ever made, so....

Not user defined micro-tuning but there are alternative tunings for internal generators in Orion (as I'm sure you are aware) so Rich is familiar with the concept of and desire for non-standard tuning. I would prefer he not spend a second adding MT to Dune 3 but if enough people want it I suppose it makes sense to add. I'm not sure if two or three people constitutes "enough" though.

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