KVR Audio

alsms · Post by **alsms** » Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:21 am

But seriously, VST is more or less a Windows relevant SDK, so why not selling it to Microsoft? Chances are they are interested, because it is more of an OS X vs. Windows thing than it is Steinberg vs. world.

FabienTDR · Post by **FabienTDR** » Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:47 pm

Mhhh... not sure to understand the problem.

We'll keep building and selling VST2, never liked or adopted their crappy VST3 cheese anyway (and consequently help and recommend switching hosts).

FabienTDR · Post by **FabienTDR** » Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:50 pm

double

T0NIT0RMX · Post by **T0NIT0RMX** » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:15 pm

FabienTDR wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:47 pm Mhhh... not sure to understand the problem.

We'll keep building and selling VST2, never liked or adopted their crappy VST3 cheese anyway (and consequently help and recommend switching hosts).

The problem is that I was not "in the game" when license were available, so now I can't get one.
That means I'm not allowed to release VST2 plugins that contains parts of the Steinberg header code. So the solution to use the free of any proprietary code : VeSTige, seems the way to go to release VST2 compatible vst2

FabienTDR · Post by **FabienTDR** » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:47 pm

That's messed up indeed.

I generally don't trust them and their vision anymore. Who guarantees they wouldn't artificially restrict VST3 as soon they try to push a VST4? Nobody. Whishing them good luck with their politics, but certainly won't help them along their way.

How exactly would Steinberg prove that you've never downloaded the VST2 headers back then? They cannot. I'd leave it at this, and maybe make sure all my customers are made aware of this sh!t.

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:59 am

T0NIT0RMX wrote: ↑Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:41 am Of course because of the GPL license of it, it would be only for free Vst, but I think there is hope here, at least from free Vst !

What do you guys think about it ?

Technically since the vestige header is 100% the work of the author, the author can apply any license they want. So if you have need to release closed source you could simply ask the author if they would provide you a license. Originally the purpose was to enable GPL projects to use the interface without infringing upon the VSTSDK copyright and so a BSD license probably didn't make sense... you'll need to ask the author about this.

Technically again however you could simply read the implementation and re-do the code yourself. So long as you do not copy anything "original" about it (such as the whole source file) but only use it to understand the interface and re-implement it yourself copyright doesn't apply here because the author lives in the EU. It isn't like you couldn't dramatically improve the quality of the implementation... no good reason to do anything the same way at all.

It would nonetheless be good to acknowledge the author (such as a BSD-like "thanks to ... for their "vestige" header implementation") even so. Again the best course is to ask the author about this as such acknowledgements might be misunderstood as endorsement and the author may not want to accept that possibility.

mystran · Post by **mystran** » Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:17 pm

I'm not a lawyer, but I'd imagine that when it comes to Steinberg's sudden refusal in order to advance it's own commercial goals to license technology that for the most part has become a de facto standard by now, at least in EU someone with the cash could probably sue for abuse of dominant position and have it hold in court without too much trouble. Personally I have enough other problems to deal with to really even think about this, but you could maybe try to get EFF involved or something. No idea if they have the resources or if they think it's worth while, but I'd imagine this might at least align with their general agenda and they should have some actual lawyers that could look into this.

WilliamK · Post by **WilliamK** » Sat Feb 09, 2019 5:20 pm

Yeah!

Mirt Klaar · Post by **Mirt Klaar** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:05 am

Just to clarify better. Steinberg doesn't allow the export of VST2 plugins only to developers and companies that have not sent the License Agreement by October 2018. Those who have already done it, they can keep on to use VST2 even if there is no longer any technical support for this format.

Mirt Klaar · Post by **Mirt Klaar** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:27 am

That's the official Steinberg reply to me:
Just one question. Since I did not have time to send the VST2 License Agreement on October 2018, I can only export VST3 plugins, right? I am not allowed to export VST2 plugins, can you confirm this?

Thank you and regards

Mirt

REPLY:

Dear Mirt,

yes that's right. We do not sign any VST 2 PLUG In's anymore.

But that my help you:

Ableton Live 10.1 now supports VST3 plug-ins
https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/live-10 ... -upgrades/

Best regards
Marisa Germann- Management Assistant -

davidguda · Post by **davidguda** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:29 am

That's right, you are only allowed to distribute VST3 now unless you already have a signed VST2 agreement.

tyronehowe · Post by **tyronehowe** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:35 am

T0NIT0 RMX: I am in a similar situation to you. It is horrible.

I am developing a VST host but would apparently still need a signed VST2 agreement in order to sell my host in the future. I missed the October 2018 deadline; I didn't know about it.

I have written to Steinberg several times but with no success. They will NOT sign any more VST2 agreements.

I am have still not decided what to do. I don’t think there is anything I can do. Hundreds and hundreds of hours of work to be thrown away.

The reason, I think, that this isn’t a bigger deal is because it affects newer developers. Like us.

tyronehowe · Post by **tyronehowe** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 12:05 pm

I should have said:

The reason, I think, that this isn’t a bigger deal is because it ONLY affects newer developers. Like us

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:11 pm

Which is, actually, a big deal in the medium to longer term as newer developers come on the scene and find they can't develop for VST2 anymore. Big problem also for companies still stupidly locked to VST2 (thinking particularly of Native Instruments)

Mirt Klaar · Post by **Mirt Klaar** » Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:11 pm

tyronehowe wrote: ↑Thu Mar 07, 2019 12:05 pm I should have said:

The reason, I think, that this isn’t a bigger deal is because it ONLY affects newer developers. Like us

Indeed

Selling VST2 after October 2018: Steinberg agreement