Where's aftertouch on most keyboards? Don't you guys use it?

[foosnark]

I also have only had experience with badly implement aftertouch that felt awkward and gimmicky, not expressive.

I also don't consider myself primarily a keyboard player; I tend to use a keyboard compositionally more than anything. I can jam a little, but most of what winds up on recordings was either sequenced in the first place, or the MIDI data was tweaked a lot.

[zvenx]

My ReMOTE SL has aftertouch, as does PUSH and my Sub 37. I wouldn't buy a midi controller without it tbh.

+1.
But it does indeed seem to be a diminishing feature.

My guess is that they are many many non-keyboardist playing keyboards in this age of soft synths.

rsp

[M.ANDE]

Gem s2 here. Really good AT. Use it for all kinds of stuff

[godly]

My ReMOTE SL has aftertouch, as does PUSH and my Sub 37. I wouldn't buy a midi controller without it tbh.

+1.
But it does indeed seem to be a diminishing feature.

My guess is that they are many many non-keyboardist playing keyboards in this age of soft synths.

rsp

My guess also, that's a real pitty

[cryophonik]

I am a keyboardist, so you can put me in the "wouldn't buy a MIDI controller/keyboard without AT" category. Not only do I use it for playing synths, I also use it as a mod source for almost every synth patch I create.

[tapper mike]

The choice as it should be is in the hands of the player.
Decades and decades of great music have been composed and performed without it.

While I found the linnstrument: Fun, exciting, novel and a wonderful tool to explore polyphonic aftertouch. I also found it quickly annoying. Sliding on either x or y axis took much more force than I felt was needed. Sliding on guitar strings or bending had just the right amount of physical feedback and doesn't require all that force. As well separate x/y pads controller strips, expression pedals are much easier to manuever. I went back to playing the ztar because it's a heck of alot more comfortable to play. I've got plenty of controls that I can easily access with one hand while the other one works out the notes.

[foosnark]

Some instruments just feel right. For me, a short-scale fretless bass is pretty much the only thing I've found where sliding is good.

I'm imagining my piano teacher from the 80s scowling at people who think keyboards aren't expressive without aftertouch Then again, she's used to an instrument with 88-note polyphony and that's just weird, man.

[Echoes in the Attic]

The choice as it should be is in the hands of the player.
Decades and decades of great music have been composed and performed without it.

While I found the linnstrument: Fun, exciting, novel and a wonderful tool to explore polyphonic aftertouch. I also found it quickly annoying. Sliding on either x or y axis took much more force than I felt was needed. Sliding on guitar strings or bending had just the right amount of physical feedback and doesn't require all that force. As well separate x/y pads controller strips, expression pedals are much easier to manuever. I went back to playing the ztar because it's a heck of alot more comfortable to play. I've got plenty of controls that I can easily access with one hand while the other one works out the notes.

Really? The linnstrument doesn't feel so good to play? I've been considering one for a while. However I haven't been able to get some simple questions about how it alternates channels or how Bitwig stores the midi and plays it back so I haven't yet purchased one. I was slightly off put as Roger Linn support told me to ask my questions on the forum and then the forum post received no replies and Bitwig also didn't answer my questions over support. So I'm pretty hesitant to buy something that is so difficult to get a couple of basic answers about before buying. But I still feel like I'd love to play it, so I'm on the fence.

[elxsound]

When I bought my synth keyboard (JV-80), it came with channel aftertouch, which was new to me. It required a lot of pressure, and I used it so much that I ended up with tendinitis. In order to avoid the pain, I had to stop playing for months and then relearn how to type and play keyboards. Years later, I'm still dealing with this issue to some extent. I've turned off aftertouch in my DAW, and I wish I'd never heard of it.

Just my experience.

On my CME-UF80, its pretty much unusable for the same reason (and is not poly). On Push 1 and Push 2, they (IMO) really did this right and made it extremely useable. Now I can use the CME-UF80 without thinking of using aftertouch and use Push for more expressive uses with aftertouch.



Is this really becoming something of the past, alongside new releases of greater midi expression with Roli Seaboard RISE, LinnStrument, Touche and others....

It seems to me that controllers are becoming more expressive at the exact same time, that maybe thanks to the ubiquitous nature of cheap mobile apps, companies are also producing keyboards to cater to the casual market.

[BERFAB]

I used my Ensoniq KS-32 for about 30 years before replacing it just this year. It has aftertouch which I found to be very expressive and useful. Over time, however, the biggest problem is that the number of synth/instrument patches that actually take advantage of aftertouch has diminished. Plus, if they do take advantage of it, there's no documentation that tells you if it's there. So I wind up just using whatever is set on the mod/pitch wheels.

I just replaced it with the NI S-88. The KS-32 was weighted action, but the NI S-88 is much closer to an actual piano-bed feel, with a much heavier action. I really haven't had time to explore the aftertouch on it yet (is there an easy way of finding patches that use aftertouch in the Komplete Ultimate family of instruments?).

Overall, I think aftertouch is most useful on stringed instrument emulations - i.e. guitars, violins, cellos, etc. Kind of what I imagine a simplified Roli might do.

Cheers
-B

[incubus]

I have never liked it, and wish it wasn't even a thing.

I can understand that a "real" keyboard player on a "real" keyboard (you know, the good stuff not the cheap ass controllers) would really like it.

But these crap controllers and the poorly implemented soft-synth stuff (as well as the poorly implemented host!!!!) combine for frustration most of the time.

Can't even usually find an off switch which means written garbage that I didn't want and have to delete later.

[chk071]

I have never liked it, and wish it wasn't even a thing.

I can understand that a "real" keyboard player on a "real" keyboard (you know, the good stuff not the cheap ass controllers) would really like it.

But these crap controllers and the poorly implemented soft-synth stuff (as well as the poorly implemented host!!!!) combine for frustration most of the time.

Can't even usually find an off switch which means written garbage that I didn't want and have to delete later.

I have no idea what you mean TBH.

[himalaya]

The choice as it should be is in the hands of the player.

Of course. But the choice for those who do not like aftertouch is easier than for those who do want it, or who even want (what for me should be the standard) polyphonic-aftertouch.

Decades and decades of great music have been composed and performed without it.

This may be true but are you really suggesting that since we have done with the least, we should remain there, we should not evolve?

This is not how the human spirit (for a lack of a better word) operates. We strive to improve and evolve. Imagine that the keyboard was never evolved past the harpsichord. The harpsichord does not have any dynamic-expression-related features. Sure, it was successfully used in music but as our understanding of the keyboard mechanism has evolved, new concepts were introduced and the pianoforte was created. All of a sudden we had dynamics on the keyboard instrument. And the very funny (tragically funny) thing is, the piano was not welcomed initially. There was resistance to its new dynamic response (and the tone, it has to be said). This is akin (it's where this tragically funny part comes in) to the resistance we see to pressure sensitivity. Some people get it, some do not, others rebel outright.

[ghettosynth]

When I bought my synth keyboard (JV-80), it came with channel aftertouch, which was new to me. It required a lot of pressure, and I used it so much that I ended up with tendinitis. In order to avoid the pain, I had to stop playing for months and then relearn how to type and play keyboards. Years later, I'm still dealing with this issue to some extent. I've turned off aftertouch in my DAW, and I wish I'd never heard of it.

Just my experience.

Roland is known for this. Did you buy it new? My JD-800's aftertouch strip is pretty much dead.

I will probably buy a DeepMind12 as my new main controller, but, I'd prefer something with poly aftertouch. I just don't know of anything that has the right specs and also seems like a good value.

[himalaya]

I've turned off aftertouch in my DAW, and I wish I'd never heard of it.

Just my experience.

A lot of the presets you may be using (if you are using presets, that is) can have some very cool stuff assigned to pressure. You may be missing all that heavenly glory, as Bruce Lee would say.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQrMgU-yQT0