Bitwig 5.2 BETA available

[SLiC]

Comp+ uses about the about the same CPU as Presswerk in HQ mode or something like UADx API 2500 on my Ryzen and M1. In which regard is that a CPU hog?

Hopefully it will be optimised, I have over 30 plug in compressors already (NI, UA, Softube,fabfilter,IK etc) so it either needs to be very light on CPU or better than what I already use to ever get used outside of rack instrument presets.

I don't get your point. Are you stating that comp+ does not offer anything over your 30 other compressors? No-one is keeping you from using the old compressor for light CPU usage (?).

I have tried it yet so I don’t know if it’s better than other plug ins, it doesn’t seem to have many features on paper (compared to say my Fabfilter compressors) so I would have assumed it’s advantage would have been light CPU use as it is integrated. I don’t think I will use it much unless it is better than what I have, I like and know how to use the compressors I have and what results to expect (and I use more than one DAW) but it’s good to have for rack chains/presets.

Has anyone actually posted a review of it yet?

[Funk Dracula]

Has anyone actually posted a review of it yet?

Not yet and frankly I hope the Bitwig youtubers hold off for a sec because I'm 99% sure they don't understand what it actually does. I don't either 100% at the moment and have kind of been saving it as the last thing to look at in the beta. (I'm more interested in learning about the applications of the new all pass filter in the Grid which is a kind of rabbit hole)

Every video I glanced at describes it as a multi-band compressor, which is incorrect, because clearly in Bitwig's own video dude specifically says it is not haha. From my glance at it, it has a really comprehensive multi-band side chain circuit of sorts. So it's like a multi-band like thing that dictates the broad band compression that actually is applied to your signal? There is alot going on with it and alot to unpack so it'll probably be a minute until we actually see a comprehensive and not misguided or incorrect video review of it.

I'll probably look at it in the next few days. Like I said, I'm currently obsessed with learning all things about the all pass at the moment. Turns out that stupid little knob they added in the Grid can do quite alot of neat stuff.

Cheers

[Jac459]

Has anyone actually posted a review of it yet?

Not yet and frankly I hope the Bitwig youtubers hold off for a sec because I'm 99% sure they don't understand what it actually does. I don't either 100% at the moment and have kind of been saving it as the last thing to look at in the beta. (I'm more interested in learning about the applications of the new all pass filter in the Grid which is a kind of rabbit hole)

Every video I glanced at describes it as a multi-band compressor, which is incorrect, because clearly in Bitwig's own video dude specifically says it is not haha. From my glance at it, it has a really comprehensive multi-band side chain circuit of sorts. So it's like a multi-band like thing that dictates the broad band compression that actually is applied to your signal? There is alot going on with it and alot to unpack so it'll probably be a minute until we actually see a comprehensive and not misguided or incorrect video review of it.

I'll probably look at it in the next few days. Like I said, I'm currently obsessed with learning all things about the all pass at the moment. Turns out that stupid little knob they added in the Grid can do quite alot of neat stuff.

Cheers

I am not a big user of the grid (actually I barely use it). But I am curious about the all pass filter. Do you mind explaining the interest you see in it?
Thanks

[pdxindy]

I have tried it yet so I don’t know if it’s better than other plug ins, it doesn’t seem to have many features on paper (compared to say my Fabfilter compressors) so I would have assumed it’s advantage would have been light CPU use as it is integrated. I don’t think I will use it much unless it is better than what I have

It only has to be as good as something I currently use to replace it cause it has the advantage of not needing to open a separate GUI. Or, if it does something different from what I have (not necessarily better or worse).

Like the filters that were added in 5.1. They are different from the many dozens of filters I have in various synths. Nothing else I have sounds like them and I've ended up using them quite a bit.

I've barely used Comp+ at this point, but it also looks fairly unique to me. It has multi-band analysis and single band compression. And it allows down to 0 for attack and release times. Then the multi-band analysis stages each have what looks like a dynamic timing control.

[mevla]

There probably are better options for mixing more "rock band" type projects (although for Linux there's not many).

Harrison's Mixbus32C.

Moreover Mixbus32C comes with built-in EQ (the 32C console EQ) and compressor on every single track. Loading the DAW means having both these FXs already on every track, making more CPU available for other mixing plugins.

As with anyone making videos giving 'advice' on how to mix, I ask : what commercial productions have you actually mixed ? Did you mix Beyoncé for instance ? Only to find out that they are more like the weekend woodworker spending more time at Home Depot than anything else.

Harrison has actually, and is still, built actual mixing consoles that mixed artists such as Frank Zappa, Supertramp, Michael Jackson, ABBA, etc... Today they make large consoles for the film industry. And produce Mixbus32C based on the Open Source Ardour DAW.

I always mixed with Mixbus32C and created with Bitwig. This allowed me to 'change hats' also, which s beneficial to get another listen at a project. And although I want to switch to Bitwig for mixing, my first attempts were not really successful, and I still wonder if I should not instead continue with Mixbus32C even though it got bought by SSL.

EDIT : When I say mixing using Bitwig I mean mixing using mostly Melda production plugins and tools.

[mevla]

I do the same. I stopped using Cubase for this task completely. There a quite a lot of people who use Bitwig for non-electronic music.

I think "123" in the signature below is an example.

And in a way, now that I use a Launchpad, illustrates how 'in your face' are the lighted unused pads jumping in mixing more turns out to be in a quiet setting.

[vroteg]

I am not a big user of the grid (actually I barely use it). But I am curious about the all pass filter. Do you mind explaining the interest you see in it?
Thanks

All pass filters rotate phase at selected frequency. Like non linear eq would do. Only all pass filter don't cut or boost frequencies. This is how kHs Disperser for example works. In desperser there a lots of all pass filters and amount controls number of them and pitch control Q factor or all pass filter or intensity of phase rotation.
Many plugins nowadays has all pass filters. Like pro q Chinese clone (forgot the name) and fabfilter volcano.

[gulugulufish]

To those complaining about bitwig adding devices to minor updates instead of working on core features. It's likely not that simple.

1. They probably have devs or contractors who primarily work on DSP and developing new devices, they are going to keep doing this because it's what they do best. It's not going to make sense for them to work on skinning, or midi comping or whatever.
2. Device development is something easily done in parallel to other core features by other devs/teams, and somewhat less of a stability risk. Less chance of stepping on the toes of those working on the core product.
3. It gives bitwig more content to round out the value of their update plans.


The speed of getting something like theme support is likely more to do with the graphics engine replacement that came with this update, as well as the overall thought and care that goes into opening that up in a good way. They are laying the groundwork, and want to get this out there to iterate on. This feels like a stepping stone release to something greater, to me, this may have been a precursor effort for a bunch of other things they are planning.

[spoontechnique]

Comp+ is actually a really clever idea. A common issue is that a kick or snare will affect the compressor way more than anything else. But if you dial down the analysis you can get less of a pumping effect.

Plus if you want it to be MB just use the Multiband container

[drsyncenstein]

To those complaining about bitwig adding devices to minor updates instead of working on core features. It's likely not that simple.

1. They probably have devs or contractors who primarily work on DSP and developing new devices, they are going to keep doing this because it's what they do best. It's not going to make sense for them to work on skinning, or midi comping or whatever.
2. Device development is something easily done in parallel to other core features by other devs/teams, and somewhat less of a stability risk. Less chance of stepping on the toes of those working on the core product.
3. It gives bitwig more content to round out the value of their update plans.


The speed of getting something like theme support is likely more to do with the graphics engine replacement that came with this update, as well as the overall thought and care that goes into opening that up in a good way. They are laying the groundwork, and want to get this out there to iterate on. This feels like a stepping stone release to something greater, to me, this may have been a precursor effort for a bunch of other things they are planning.

4. spread out development costs by reusing previous dsp development efforts for new devices.
(develop better saturation or filter dsp, next add it to more devices)

Devices are not a problem in itself, it's just that we have higher standards for new Bitwig devices.

[drsyncenstein]

Comp+ is actually a really clever idea. A common issue is that a kick or snare will affect the compressor way more than anything else. But if you dial down the analysis you can get less of a pumping effect.

Plus if you want it to be MB just use the Multiband container

engineers have been using eq in the sidechain to work around this for ages

[lodsb]

Comp+ is actually a really clever idea. A common issue is that a kick or snare will affect the compressor way more than anything else. But if you dial down the analysis you can get less of a pumping effect.

Plus if you want it to be MB just use the Multiband container

engineers have been using eq in the sidechain to work around this for ages

Yes, but it is not only frequency dependent threshold but also frequency dependent ratio and timing.

[Jac459]

I am not a big user of the grid (actually I barely use it). But I am curious about the all pass filter. Do you mind explaining the interest you see in it?
Thanks

All pass filters rotate phase at selected frequency. Like non linear eq would do. Only all pass filter don't cut or boost frequencies. This is how kHs Disperser for example works. In desperser there a lots of all pass filters and amount controls number of them and pitch control Q factor or all pass filter or intensity of phase rotation.
Many plugins nowadays has all pass filters. Like pro q Chinese clone (forgot the name) and fabfilter volcano.

Oh yeah, disperser-like. Of course.
I could have guessed from title.
Thanks mate.

[coroknight]

Compressor+ uses multiband analysis and combines the results into single-band compression…. Unless you put it into “prism” mode, then it’ll add subtle multiband compression on top of the single-band compression.

It can be hard to tell the difference unless you use more extreme settings, but it’s there.

[foosnark]

I am not a big user of the grid (actually I barely use it). But I am curious about the all pass filter. Do you mind explaining the interest you see in it?
Thanks

All pass filters rotate phase at selected frequency. Like non linear eq would do. Only all pass filter don't cut or boost frequencies. This is how kHs Disperser for example works. In desperser there a lots of all pass filters and amount controls number of them and pitch control Q factor or all pass filter or intensity of phase rotation.
Many plugins nowadays has all pass filters. Like pro q Chinese clone (forgot the name) and fabfilter volcano.

Oh yeah, disperser-like. Of course.
I could have guessed from title.
Thanks mate.

A lot of reverb designs use a combination of delays and allpass filters.

One other thing an allpass filter can do is change waveshape without changing the spectrum. Square wave goes in, something "curved" goes out but it sounds the same. That affects how different distortion methods work with it -- normally you can't usefully wavefold a square, but you can if you hit in with an allpass filter. Also, phase modulation with a square as the modulator is weird and it can fix that.

I'm not sure if it would apply as well in a virtual modular system as it does in analog, but sometimes an allpass filter inside a feedback loop can have some pretty wild effects too.