Steinberg Cubase vs logic

[cryophonik]

I say we have a commitee to vote whether or not this thread should continue.

We'll first need to convene a committee to choose the committee members.

[Weasel-Boy]

Cubase is $899

Really? Sweetwater is offering the full pro version for $405.00.
https://www.sweetwater.com/c699--Soft_D ... lsrc=aw.ds

[chk071]

Thomann also has it for 399 €, and the crossgrade from selected DAWs is about 250 €.

[Trensharo]

Thomann also has it for 399 €, and the crossgrade from selected DAWs is about 250 €.

Yes, they're running a 30% off sale at the moment - both at Steinberg and at resellers.

[Trensharo]

Feature limitations are an issue with the lower tier Cubase versions. E.g., they also only implemented the new routing options in Cubase 13 in the Pro version. For whatever unfathomable reason.

If I had to guess, I don't think Cubase Elements sells many licenses, anyways. It's really cheap to upgrade from Cubase AI to Cubase Pro, to the point that it's often cheaper to buy a Steinberg Interface and Upgrade than get Cubase Elements and upgrade from there.

[lotus2035]

Another thing to consider is cost price…
Logic is $299
Cubase is $899
Logic upgrades over past 10 years cost $0 - zero dollars
Cubase upgrades over past 10 years were $99 every year - that is on top of original purchase price
I let you be the judge…

I bought (and sold) the full version of Cubase twice since it was version 6.5, last full version I had was 12. I never paid a huge amount for it, even for upgrades, there's always some sale on or some deal going somewhere including here on KVR. Not to mention the other cheaper versions like Cubase Artist and Elements. The latter which I've recently bought to try out after a few years of using FL Studio. Honestly I'm pleasantly surprised how full featured Elements 13 is, overall I would say it's a better program than the old flagship Cubase 5.
I miss variaudio though, but those are included with Artist. Upgrade would cost me around $150 right now but will probably go for cheaper next black friday sales.

Cubase Elements 13 doesn't even support Audio Comping. It also doesn't support Audio Warp Quantize, Audio Alignment and Lacks VariAudio 3 while simultaneously lacking ARA2 Support.

It's actually really hard to live within its feature set if you record audio.

I think Production is fine as long as you don't have to Render in-place or need things like Tempo Detection or MPE/Note Expression Support. They at least added Sidechaining (v11, IIRC) for the EDM newbies

They probably should have kept Beat Designer in as a stock MIDI FX, along with a basic Arpache (though you could just record in your ARPs using a MIDI Controller's FW Arpeggiator - most have that, these days).

-----

If someone has a Mac, I think Logic Pro is a better value than Cubase Artist/Pro. I don't think Cubase Elements is worth wasting money on.

I think Studio One Artist is a better pickup than Cubase Elements at that tier, as well.

It drops the track limitations and adds ARA2, Comping, Step Sequencer (Pattern Editor), Track Freezing, Transient Detection, Groove Extraction, Event FX, Sound Variations, MPE Support, Audio Warp, Studio One Remote App and all their stock virtual instruments.

I could see someone living in Studio One Artist. Cubase Elements is very dubious because the way features are distribute across their product SKUs create odd disparities in the entry SKU.

Hey you didn't mention any of the things Elements actually does. Like allowing you to create and mix entire compositions of your own music to professional standards. What happened to less is more? How ever did musical legends back in the day ever get anything done without Variaudio and audio warp quantizing or all the other bells and whistles you mentioned that won't make a huge difference to the end result? Not everyone needs to go down a tech rabbit hole to get results you know. Oh the OP was banned. Nevermind.

[djbthemachine]

cubase it is one of the best daw but its expensive plus you have to pay for mayor upgrades

[musicartist99]

I think it depends if you're on mac or windows.

If you're on mac, I don't think there's anything better than Logic, from what people say.

If you're on windows, Cubase, if you have to choose only from these 2 options.

[machinesworking]

Personally I think Cubase handles third party controllers fantastically, has a very straightforward UX and adopts new features at a breakneck rate. Logic has better Instruments and FX, more sequencing options, and a super fast interface. I gear more towards Digital Performer and then maybe Reaper personally, but the one major advantage of Logic is you could really just use the internal FX and instruments and be just fine, there isn't any real need for more. Cubase might be the most intuitive complex old school DAW out there though, Logic has it's quirks.

[Trensharo]

Another thing to consider is cost price…
Logic is $299
Cubase is $899
Logic upgrades over past 10 years cost $0 - zero dollars
Cubase upgrades over past 10 years were $99 every year - that is on top of original purchase price
I let you be the judge…

I bought (and sold) the full version of Cubase twice since it was version 6.5, last full version I had was 12. I never paid a huge amount for it, even for upgrades, there's always some sale on or some deal going somewhere including here on KVR. Not to mention the other cheaper versions like Cubase Artist and Elements. The latter which I've recently bought to try out after a few years of using FL Studio. Honestly I'm pleasantly surprised how full featured Elements 13 is, overall I would say it's a better program than the old flagship Cubase 5.
I miss variaudio though, but those are included with Artist. Upgrade would cost me around $150 right now but will probably go for cheaper next black friday sales.

Cubase Elements 13 doesn't even support Audio Comping. It also doesn't support Audio Warp Quantize, Audio Alignment and Lacks VariAudio 3 while simultaneously lacking ARA2 Support.

It's actually really hard to live within its feature set if you record audio.

I think Production is fine as long as you don't have to Render in-place or need things like Tempo Detection or MPE/Note Expression Support. They at least added Sidechaining (v11, IIRC) for the EDM newbies

They probably should have kept Beat Designer in as a stock MIDI FX, along with a basic Arpache (though you could just record in your ARPs using a MIDI Controller's FW Arpeggiator - most have that, these days).

-----

If someone has a Mac, I think Logic Pro is a better value than Cubase Artist/Pro. I don't think Cubase Elements is worth wasting money on.

I think Studio One Artist is a better pickup than Cubase Elements at that tier, as well.

It drops the track limitations and adds ARA2, Comping, Step Sequencer (Pattern Editor), Track Freezing, Transient Detection, Groove Extraction, Event FX, Sound Variations, MPE Support, Audio Warp, Studio One Remote App and all their stock virtual instruments.

I could see someone living in Studio One Artist. Cubase Elements is very dubious because the way features are distribute across their product SKUs create odd disparities in the entry SKU.

Hey you didn't mention any of the things Elements actually does. Like allowing you to create and mix entire compositions of your own music to professional standards. What happened to less is more? How ever did musical legends back in the day ever get anything done without Variaudio and audio warp quantizing or all the other bells and whistles you mentioned that won't make a huge difference to the end result? Not everyone needs to go down a tech rabbit hole to get results you know. Oh the OP was banned. Nevermind.

The people who buy Elements don't care about that. The other stuff is far more fundamental and is far more likely to affect them.

You keep talking about $0-99 Entry Level DAW SKUs like they're supposed to compete with Pro Tools | Ultimate.

Talk about missing the forest through the trees.

Cubase Elements is half the price of Logic Pro. Most upstarts with a Mac would be crazy to spend that much for those limitations over just going straight to Logic Pro.

[Zikax]

Personally I think Cubase handles third party controllers fantastically, has a very straightforward UX and adopts new features at a breakneck rate. Logic has better Instruments and FX, more sequencing options, and a super fast interface. I gear more towards Digital Performer and then maybe Reaper personally, but the one major advantage of Logic is you could really just use the internal FX and instruments and be just fine, there isn't any real need for more. Cubase might be the most intuitive complex old school DAW out there though, Logic has it's quirks.

Cubase added fantastic new Instruments in version 12 & 13. The Piano and String Library in Cubase is much better compared to what Logic has to offer. What i like about Logic is Alchamy and the Samplers.

Some Fx who are better in Cubase:
EQ (frequency2) > Logic EQ
Limiter (Raiser) > Logic Limiter
FX Modulator > Beat Breaker

[machinesworking]

Personally I think Cubase handles third party controllers fantastically, has a very straightforward UX and adopts new features at a breakneck rate. Logic has better Instruments and FX, more sequencing options, and a super fast interface. I gear more towards Digital Performer and then maybe Reaper personally, but the one major advantage of Logic is you could really just use the internal FX and instruments and be just fine, there isn't any real need for more. Cubase might be the most intuitive complex old school DAW out there though, Logic has it's quirks.

Cubase added fantastic new Instruments in version 12 & 13. The Piano and String Library in Cubase is much better compared to what Logic has to offer. What i like about Logic is Alchamy and the Samplers.

Some Fx who are better in Cubase:
EQ (frequency2) > Logic EQ
Limiter (Raiser) > Logic Limiter
FX Modulator > Beat Breaker

Alchemy is amazing though, I would hazard to say it's the #1 embedded plugin in a DAW and for good reasons right? I also think Logics multi compressor is pretty dammed cool. The drum machines are better as well. I would give Cubase the built in orchestral instruments, but most of us end up buying third party for orchestral libraries, there's nothing like Opus, Cinesamples, VSL etc. in a DAW since they cost as much or more than a DAW. But yeah the built in library in Logic is geared more towards electronic music. Live 12 Site probably beats Logic in terms of built in now, the new instruments are fantastic.

Personally though the main things I think about with a DAW is workflow, I have something like 400 plugins so I don't really need anything from my DAW besides a good piano roll and automation features. I would say some things in Logic are great piano roll wise, but the automation is not that great. Cubase and Digital Performer are the two DAWs I know of that can draw out sine, square, triangle etc. automation, and I find that really useful. [You can approximate this with Clips in Logic, Bitwig and Live of course.]

Logics step sequencer is fantastic though, nothing like it in other DAWs.

[mothra]

Damn I always forget about that little detail, Logic's got it beat by miles if you need samplers out of the box. Sampler (aka EXS24 3.0), Quick Sampler, Alchemy.. I had to pay extra for Halion for Cubase, but that said, I don't miss the samplers from Logic and I rarely use my EMU now because of it.

Logic's are great and probably all you will need. My one gripe with it, if you spend a lot of time building a big sample library, it stays inside Logic. Halion, Kontakt, TAL Sampler, etc, being a VST/AU instrument, you can move those around to other DAW's and whatnot. One day you might not want to use a Mac anymore, or need to ditch Logic for whatever reason. On top of having to learn (and buy) a new DAW, you'll end up starting all over if your library is stuck in the Logic/Apple ecosystem.

With Cubase, all of the instruments you get, Retrologue, Halion Sonic, Groove Agent SE, etc.. Those are all just regular old VST/AU plugins. They're tied to your Cubase license but you can use those in other DAW's, Mac or PC, etc..

[machinesworking]

I bought way too many DAWs looking for MPE compatibility a few years ago, including Logic, but honestly I mostly stick with Digital Performer, because it's quirks are useful to me, and really DAW jumping is a huge waste of time if you really want to get surgical on your songs. I can do 99% of what I do in any DAW, but it's great to know a DAW like the back of your hand.

I think the issue is, (and why threads like this pop up), that once you really know a DAW, you also know every quirk, UX shortcoming and long term bug it has, and that makes for wanderlust. Thing is there is no perfect DAW, and they all are pretty fantastic at this point.

Compatibility wise, it's a ruse. I collaborate with a friend who also owns Live, and we have issues with plugins all the time, it's best to just render to audio, commit, and be done with it, or decide on a set of tools.

[harddaysnight]

I've got PC and Mac, I own Cubase 13 Pro and Logic. As well as some other DAWs. These are the only two "full" versions I own though - everything else is lower-tier or rent-to-own etc.

Logic for me is ruled out because it's not cross-platform, even if it was, I don't love it and don't feel inspired to make music in it. The Logic Drummer is awesome to mess with though and I've used it in a couple of songs I've released.. but I don't like working in Logic. I find it unintuitive.

Cubase 13 Pro ticks every both I need, in theory, but in practice, I don't like using it.
It's got ARA support. It's great for recording audio. It's great with MIDI editing. It has plenty of killer stock plugins.
It does a lot of things right.

But I don't love using it. Maybe I need to spend more time in it - but all the different windows is annoying, and some features that have good integration with it ie HALion and GrooveAgent etc require additional cash to be spent in order to make full use of. I'm aware you don't need full versions of any of these, but I personally like to own everything a DAW has to offer.

I'm tempted to sell off my licence, but it's hard to justify why.. because I don't like it? But what if I don't like it because I haven't spent enough time with it. You can get used to the windows - I like FL Studio, and am considering picking that up - so there's a certain hypocrisy there, I'm willing to overlook FL's windows because I find FL Studio fun as heck - but I'm less willing to overlook them for Cubase, because I don't find it super fun.

Right now, I'm switching from Studio One - switching DAWs has been one of the most unproductive things I've done in my life. I hate wasting time on this. I'm "lucky" enough that I've wasted money on picking some DAWs up in the past for pretty much no real reason, so I haven't lost any money searching for a new DAW yet (not to mention everything has a trial).


I'd choose Cubase in a 1v1 against Logic, simply because it's cross-platform.