Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion
mtelesha
KVRist
219 posts since 21 May, 2018

Post Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:45 am

I vote for Tracktion as the best way to sketch out ideas. It has a chord track that works with the midi generator and has a great step editors\.
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Waveform and Bitwig are my DAWs and UHe is my Bae. I maybe buy one synth a year. REMEMBER SELF just one synth a year!

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Saffran
KVRist
310 posts since 20 Oct, 2018

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:41 am

bharris22 wrote:
Wed May 22, 2019 3:18 am
This thread is a little depressing - neither Orion nor Phrazor are available anywhere any more - is that correct?
Found this, https://phrazor.software.informer.com/
Seems to be a 32-bit demo.

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Karma_tba
KVRian
1079 posts since 12 Aug, 2004

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:57 am

I often still use Orion to quickly sketch out ideas...yes I know it's not available....It's always been installed on my machine. It has it's limitations but it loads so fast I'm getting ideas down before Studio 1 (my main DAW) is done loading! When you're a senile old bastard like me you can lose a train of thought to a long load time. Plus when I want to just play around with an instrument there's no waiting!

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crimsonwarlock
KVRAF
2288 posts since 18 Apr, 2001 from The Netherlands

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:27 am

I just dropped the document on the Reaper stash :-D

https://stash.reaper.fm/36548/Reper_loo ... rkflow.pdf
CrimsonWarlock aka TechnoGremlin, using Reaper and a fine selection of freeware plugins.

Ragnarök VST-synthesizer co-creator with Full Bucket

MusicMayor
KVRer
24 posts since 7 Dec, 2007

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 7:36 am

crimsonwarlock wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:27 am
I just dropped the document on the Reaper stash :-D

https://stash.reaper.fm/36548/Reper_loo ... rkflow.pdf
Can't wait to read it!

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crimsonwarlock
KVRAF
2288 posts since 18 Apr, 2001 from The Netherlands

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:35 am

@MusicMayor: hope it is useful for you. If you have any remarks, suggestions or critique then let me know here, and we can see if we can make it even better.

In the meantime the props support recovered my serial so I have Reason Adapted running, just to find it is TINY! on my 2K screen. I admit it is an older version, but I'm yet inclined to get a current version. Will play a bit with it to see if it has value for me to maybe rewire it into reaper but I'm not holding my breath.
CrimsonWarlock aka TechnoGremlin, using Reaper and a fine selection of freeware plugins.

Ragnarök VST-synthesizer co-creator with Full Bucket

dellboy
KVRian
1093 posts since 28 Mar, 2007

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:13 am

mtelesha wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:45 am
I vote for Tracktion as the best way to sketch out ideas. It has a chord track that works with the midi generator and has a great step editors\.
For a quick sketchpad Tracktion\Waveform is the clear winner in the budget department, and maybe overall.

I have set up a template with ten tracks with a different instrument on each track. I made and assigned virtual midi inputs to each track. This allows changing tracks using a keyboards midi channel setting. Make a four bar loop and hit click and record.

The sequencer can run without recording anything to a track. Select midi channel one on your master keyboard and play. It can usually do a perfect loop if you have reasonable timing and keyboard skills.

Without stopping record, select midi channel two and play. Carry on like this selecting different midi channels until the basic song is sketched.

Turn on pop up help to find what all the different icons on top of the clips do, and experiment at looping, rendering in place, duplicating, moving data within clips etc. It truly fulfills the meaning of the word "intuitive".

I have tried to replicate this very simple workflow on Cubase - Studio One - Sonar - Live without success, although I will keep experimenting to find a way.

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crimsonwarlock
KVRAF
2288 posts since 18 Apr, 2001 from The Netherlands

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:24 am

dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:13 am
I have set up a template with ten tracks with a different instrument on each track. I made and assigned virtual midi inputs to each track. This allows changing tracks using a keyboards midi channel setting. Make a four bar loop and hit click and record.
That is all handled by my Komplete keyboard without the need to setup anything. Using track arm when selected in reaper will do this with almost any midi controller keyboard.
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:13 am
The sequencer can run without recording anything to a track. Select midi channel one on your master keyboard and play. It can usually do a perfect loop if you have reasonable timing and keyboard skills.
My setup in reaper let you play a loop until you have a good version, then it keeps that final version. If your timing is off, just play until you have a good one.
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:13 am
Without stopping record, select midi channel two and play. Carry on like this selecting different midi channels until the basic song is sketched.
Again, no need for all that midi-channel stuff with my keyboard.
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:13 am
Turn on pop up help to find what all the different icons on top of the clips do, and experiment at looping, rendering in place, duplicating, moving data within clips etc. It truly fulfills the meaning of the word "intuitive".
Knowing how to use your software is handy for any DAW. It's not Tracktion specific.
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:13 am
I have tried to replicate this very simple workflow on Cubase - Studio One - Sonar - Live without success, although I will keep experimenting to find a way.
I'd say the workflow I have now implemented in reaper is way simpler and much more controllable with MIDI-actions, because of the custom actions in reaper.
CrimsonWarlock aka TechnoGremlin, using Reaper and a fine selection of freeware plugins.

Ragnarök VST-synthesizer co-creator with Full Bucket

dellboy
KVRian
1093 posts since 28 Mar, 2007

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am

crimsonwarlock wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:24 am

I'd say the workflow I have now implemented in reaper is way simpler and much more controllable with MIDI-actions, because of the custom actions in reaper.
I agree that such a workflow is possible in Reaper after spending hours setting up templates - but in Tracktion it can be accomplished at the default level (almost). It takes a bit of head scratching to setup the virtual midi inputs and midi filter channels, but once done you are away.

I did read you PDF yesterday, and it was interesting, but you do have the added advantage of owning the best midi controller currently available. It colorful displays help to alleviate the dull monotony of Reapers interface and brighten your day (literally).

Tracktion already has a very colorful and fun interface which can be used with the cheapest controller.

But its at the clip level of editing that Tracktion really shines - its super easy -peasy. :)

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crimsonwarlock
KVRAF
2288 posts since 18 Apr, 2001 from The Netherlands

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 9:33 am

dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am
I agree that such a workflow is possible in Reaper after spending hours setting up templates
It took me less then an hour to find out how to do it. Setting up those actions takes just minutes.
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am

but in Tracktion it can be accomplished at the default level (almost). It takes a bit of head scratching to setup the virtual midi inputs and midi filter channels, but once done you are away.
So you need to do some 'setting-up' in Tracktion as well. And you end up with something that seems a bit of hhassle to me (from your description).
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am
I did read you PDF yesterday, and it was interesting, but you do have the added advantage of owning the best midi controller currently available.
But my PDF has information about getting this to work without that shiny keyboard. It's pretty shiny though, I'll grant you that :D
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am
It colorful displays help to alleviate the dull monotony of Reapers interface and brighten your day (literally).
Wait a minute... who are you calling dull here :clown:

My reaper setup is plenty colorful thank you very much :P
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am
Tracktion already has a very colorful and fun interface which can be used with the cheapest controller.
The cheapest controller works very fine in reaper, no problems there. But in reaper you have the FREE webRemote option to make working with that cheap controller a pure delight. Nothing like that in Tracktion :hihi:
dellboy wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:36 am
But its at the clip level of editing that Tracktion really shines - its super easy -peasy. :)
Reaper is also incredibly powerful when it comes to editing, so no brownie points there either.

Bottom line (for me) is that I can do something like you did in Tracktion and get halfway where I want to be, or build the exact workflow I want in reaper with a handful of custom actions :shrug:
CrimsonWarlock aka TechnoGremlin, using Reaper and a fine selection of freeware plugins.

Ragnarök VST-synthesizer co-creator with Full Bucket

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mumpcake
KVRian
1117 posts since 27 Aug, 2004

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Fri Jun 14, 2019 3:21 pm

toonertik wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 3:41 am
Not much help to you but I still use Cakewalk's Project5... only 32 bit, no multicore but simple and fast..
I always associate Orion and Project as being kinda similar.. (I am refering to early Orion, circa 2000).
Even if the piano player can't play, keep the party going.
http://www.soundclick.com/mumpcake
https://mumpfucious.wordpress.com/

dellboy
KVRian
1093 posts since 28 Mar, 2007

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:46 am

crimsonwarlock wrote:
Fri Jun 14, 2019 9:33 am


Reaper is also incredibly powerful when it comes to editing, so no brownie points there either.

Bottom line (for me) is that I can do something like you did in Tracktion and get halfway where I want to be, or build the exact workflow I want in reaper with a handful of custom actions :shrug:
I hear the word "powerful" used all the time about DAWs, but its not something I need. What I want to do is to make music super easy peasy. I already have two powerful DAWs - Cubase Pro - and Studio One Pro, but do I ever need or use that raw power ?

I do have an old Reaper license somewhere, but I can never figure out easy things in it, let alone the "power" ones. I read your pdf, and thought I would give Reaper another go, but just getting it to loop without going into take mode was enough for me to give up after half an hour.

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crimsonwarlock
KVRAF
2288 posts since 18 Apr, 2001 from The Netherlands

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:30 am

dellboy wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:46 am
just getting it to loop without going into take mode was enough for me to give up after half an hour.
That takes one mouse click to set a midi clip to replace/overdub mode instead of takes. The use of takes in my setup is to prevent you from loosing stuff when at the end of your loop and you like what you have, the loop restarts and you overwrite what is there. The takes make it possible to have a loop that records over and over again until you get it right, but then keep that last one you just did while the loop still starts to record over.
CrimsonWarlock aka TechnoGremlin, using Reaper and a fine selection of freeware plugins.

Ragnarök VST-synthesizer co-creator with Full Bucket

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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
25213 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:17 am

Distorted Horizon wrote:
Sat May 18, 2019 5:38 am
Aloysius wrote:
Sat May 18, 2019 5:18 am
Much easier than learning two applications at once.
I use 4 daws :oops:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp5sXbuBUKs

I love the Session View in Live for getting ideas down quickly and easily ...

johnwoo
KVRist
35 posts since 7 May, 2012

Re: Which DAW for sketching out ideas fast (and easy)

Post Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:38 am

Best way to sketch a song is ... an hardware workstation ... I have like everybody else Reaper and Studio One , but at some point , I start to lose time , searching for presets , the right drums etc... With workstation the flow is there , drums , bass , lead , arps and drum tracks , computer good , but slow in my opinion ... hardware workstation (any) fast and easy ...
My 2 cents ...

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