Best all in one synth for beginners?
-
VELLTONE MUSIC VELLTONE MUSIC https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=404834
- KVRAF
- 2048 posts since 19 Sep, 2017 from The Future
Take Synthmaster One,there will be a lot more cool presets in default factory with upcoming updates.
-
- KVRAF
- 4404 posts since 13 Jul, 2004 from Earth
+1VELLTONE MUSIC wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:45 am Take Synthmaster One,there will be a lot more cool presets in default factory with upcoming updates.
-
- KVRAF
- 3735 posts since 17 Sep, 2016
SM One is not perfect, but for the money is hard to beat! Cool factory preset collection, and some great sounds!
Pretty much everything is laid out where you can find it on a single page.
https://youtu.be/HK9uoxc-RqY
Pretty much everything is laid out where you can find it on a single page.
https://youtu.be/HK9uoxc-RqY
Windows 10 and too many plugins
-
generaldiomedes generaldiomedes https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=396947
- KVRian
- 674 posts since 15 Apr, 2017 from Canada
agreed, plus it can be a very basic synth if you want it to be.
But, some days I get tired of fighting with the LFOs which I did not find intuitive at all or the lack of a proper arpeggiator
Last edited by generaldiomedes on Tue Mar 26, 2019 5:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
-
- KVRer
- 17 posts since 16 Feb, 2019
- KVRAF
- 4534 posts since 17 Jun, 2013 from very close to Paris, France
When someone asks me for a newbye synth, I always answer that the best newbye synth is a synth which is the most simple possible and using the synthesis which is the basis of all the rest : the subtractive synthesis and nothing else.
It must have
The complexity will come later.
I remember that when I learned the music in the mid-60's it was with simply a piano and a flute, then at the beginning of the 70's I learned to play guitar while I was (at 12 y.o.) and excellent pianist and an excellent flutist, and it's only at 15 y.o. that I learned the synthesis with very simple synths : a Synthi AKS (which was not mine) in 1975, then a Farfisa Syntorchestra (which became my first owned synth) in 1976 then a Korg Polysix in 1985. It's only in 1987 that I learned the PD synthesis with my first Casio CZ-101 and only in 1992 that I learned the FM synthesis with a second hand DX-7.
Today these very expensive instruments are all free for beginners thanks to the computers, but it is not a reason to burn the steps. Today's young minds are obviously much more rapid to catch the rudiments, yes... but the progression steps MUST be respected to prevent any dispersion which is a natural human attraction to test what makes this or that knob without learning exactly what its purpose is and what happens precisely, graphically, in the sound when it is activated !
Knowing that, I then:
All that is the list of steps required (and in the right order) to learn the subtractive synthesis, the most important synthesis to learn because it is the one which gives all the most important knowledge of the basis but also because it is in this subtractive synthesis that we find the main features which will then be in the heart of all the next synthesis learned and used later.
It must have
- Two oscillators, to learn the basis of the oscillations and the most elementary knowledge in simple modulations (FM, PM, RM).
- A HPF filter and a LPF filter (the second one with resonance.
- One or two LFOs. One can perfectly be enough.
- An ADSR envelope (multi-segment envelopes will be learned later when the rudiments of what is an envelope are acquired).
- Some common effects (embedded or in other plugins) with very simple tweaks. Some of these effects must be modulations and others must be time based effects.
So: an equalizer (to understand correctly the different harmonics linked to octaves in a timbre, a phaser, a flanger, a chorus, a delay, and a reverb. Nothing else at the beginning. And additionally (at the end of the list, not in its middle), a limiter to learn the rudiments of the dynamics sides of the sound.
And these effects must be LEARNED AFTER the rudiments of the synthesis. - And the GUIs of that synth must be clear enough to make the easier possible the process of understanding what will be learned.
The complexity will come later.
I remember that when I learned the music in the mid-60's it was with simply a piano and a flute, then at the beginning of the 70's I learned to play guitar while I was (at 12 y.o.) and excellent pianist and an excellent flutist, and it's only at 15 y.o. that I learned the synthesis with very simple synths : a Synthi AKS (which was not mine) in 1975, then a Farfisa Syntorchestra (which became my first owned synth) in 1976 then a Korg Polysix in 1985. It's only in 1987 that I learned the PD synthesis with my first Casio CZ-101 and only in 1992 that I learned the FM synthesis with a second hand DX-7.
Today these very expensive instruments are all free for beginners thanks to the computers, but it is not a reason to burn the steps. Today's young minds are obviously much more rapid to catch the rudiments, yes... but the progression steps MUST be respected to prevent any dispersion which is a natural human attraction to test what makes this or that knob without learning exactly what its purpose is and what happens precisely, graphically, in the sound when it is activated !
Knowing that, I then:
- l aways suggest a list of around 10 small freeware synths (TAL-Elektro, TAL-NoiseMaker, Tyrell Nexus 6, Mono/Fury, Nabla, Free Alpha, PG-8X, Xhip, OB-Xd...) which fit perfectly to make understand easily the rudiments of the synthesis without offering other features which lead to dispersions and to disturbances.
- And I second this first list by a second one focused on the most important effects to know (those above, an equalizer (to understand correctly the different harmonics linked to octaves in a timbre, a phaser, a flanger, a chorus, a delay, and a reverb. And additionally, totally at the end of the list, a limiter), but insisting on the importance to learn the synthesis itself before learning the effects. The list of effects is always ended by a limiter to let the new musician learn the rudiments of the dynamics once the rudiments of the synthesis then the rudiments of the effects are learned, never before. But this element is extremely important in the pleasure which will be reached by the learner when comes the time to enjoy not only the learning stage but now the moment of actually playing.
All that is the list of steps required (and in the right order) to learn the subtractive synthesis, the most important synthesis to learn because it is the one which gives all the most important knowledge of the basis but also because it is in this subtractive synthesis that we find the main features which will then be in the heart of all the next synthesis learned and used later.
- And always I suggest a short panel of excellent books to learn the subtractive synthesis step by step. The book from Rob Papen for example, and some other books (a have a dozen of other examples, from Simon Can, Brian Shepard, Martin Russ, Mark Jenkins, Mark Vail, Andrea Pejrolo, Dean Friedman, Steve De Furia... and it also depends the native language of the person and also his technical level in other domains) of this same excellent quality made precisely to learn step by step without going anywhere... or even worse: nowhere.
- In parallel I highly recommend some books to add the beginner to learn (or revise) the rudiments of the music rules (harmony and melody rules) and of the rhythms, and some keyboard exercises to train his fingers and to make enter the best the practice of the musical keyboard. Because it is totally mad to think that one can learn correctly the synths without learning the music knowledge. Improvisation is music, yes... but only from the hands of correct musicians who already have a quite good practice of the music. Otherwise it leads not to improvisation as it is defined in music (variations on the inspiration but always following the rules of music)... but to a kind of soup which is all what you want but actually not music.
Build your life everyday as if you would live for a thousand years. Marvel at the Life everyday as if you would die tomorrow.
I'm now severely diseased since September 2018.
I'm now severely diseased since September 2018.
-
- KVRian
- 913 posts since 9 Aug, 2018
I’d start with freeware while learning, and there’s a lot to choose from there, with many great ones already mentioned upthread.
I agree though that Serum is a great choice, should you be keen on spending ‘big’.
I agree though that Serum is a great choice, should you be keen on spending ‘big’.
-
- KVRist
- 398 posts since 25 Aug, 2018
@BlackWinny: Unfortunately, the "4 Element Synth" by Rob Papen is no longer available. Any idea where to get a copy?
-
thecontrolcentre thecontrolcentre https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=76240
- KVRAF
- 35098 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny
- KVRAF
- 4534 posts since 17 Jun, 2013 from very close to Paris, France
You may replace it by some excellent courses for example as the one that I prefer among the online courses: Syntorial.courtjestr wrote: ↑Sun Jul 14, 2019 4:53 pm @BlackWinny: Unfortunately, the "4 Element Synth" by Rob Papen is no longer available. Any idea where to get a copy?
I agree with Ryan Leach when he writes this : Syntorial is the Absolute Best Way to Learn Synthesis – Ryan Leach | Composer.
But it is quite expensive: $160 (€143 currently).
But you are really satisfied for the money spent: 199 videos courses! (the first 22 are free).
It is the same quality as the book from Rob Papen and its 4 DVDs included.
There is a couple of dangers when learning the DSP with too much complex synths. The first one is to be disturbed by the huge number of features which are not essential for the current step in the learning curve (and the plethora of features is really disturbing in the mind of a rookie), and the second one is to be lead to mistaken paths by features which are too much specific to the synth used for the lesson. The student MUST use exclusively the modules and the techniques which are taught in the curse, otherwise he will begin to "specialize" his technique to THAT synth, which is the worse way to learn the basics of the synthesis. That's why I always recommend to learn the rudiments of synthesis on real modular synths (even software ones) as Synthedit or Flowstone or MUX or Tangle, because the student build exactly what is asked by the teacher... using exclusively the common elements shared by all the synths of the world and only these ones and without any disturbance by tons of knobs appearing on a panel (or a GUI) which are without any relation with the purpose of the current course.
I'm looking in my own Kindle Library (I have a huge library of ebooks related to music theory and to DSP) those which could fit for excellent starter courses with exclusively features which are common to ALL the synths.
Build your life everyday as if you would live for a thousand years. Marvel at the Life everyday as if you would die tomorrow.
I'm now severely diseased since September 2018.
I'm now severely diseased since September 2018.
- KVRAF
- 8814 posts since 6 Jan, 2017 from Outer Space
Serious? Its the most complex and complete, but I have to say probably. I own it, it has the most technocratic manual imaginable and though I have over 30 years experience in synth sound design, its extremely hard to read and get your head around it. Definitely something to discourage a beginner from starting to learn at all...
Bitwigs Grid would be the best to learn synthesis, but its buried within Bitwig and is locked out of the 8-track version. VCV rack is also an option, but its stand alone. And there is the free Modulair from Fullbucket. In modulars you always have the option to look at waveforms at specific points it helps to analyze and to limit you to just the modules you are about to learn...
The already mentioned Syntorial is a perfect start, even if you won’t go beyond the free lessons...
-
- KVRer
- 6 posts since 20 Jul, 2019
For a newbie is Synthmaster a better choice then? I see Serum is preferred by many here, but is more expensive and is apparently notorious for its high CPU usage.VELLTONE MUSIC wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:45 am Take https://hu.flatfy.com/ Synthmaster One,there will be a lot more cool presets in default factory with upcoming updates.
Last edited by kovacsszandra on Thu Aug 01, 2019 6:28 pm, edited 3 times in total.