Ableton is everywhere...

[rmacattack]

Why the older heads so bitter in this thread?

[tooneba]

that's so easy to set up that you must pay curses to learn how to do it. Live is king of business.

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model. Feed more ad, feed more gibberish, feed more likes, sell more software, get more ad, get more likes, get paid. This statics may give us a glance into it.

[PieBerger]

that's so easy to set up that you must pay curses to learn how to do it. Live is king of business.

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model. Feed more ad, feed more gibberish, feed more likes, sell more software, get more ad, get more likes, get paid. This statics may give us a glance into it.

Wow, I've read some crazy stuff on KVR over the years, but this is just something else...

What is so hard to understand about Ableton Live simply being a popular DAW because it has a great feature set that appeals to people who want to write music quickly, in a fun and intuitive way (compared to most other DAWs) and or perform it live, particularly electronic music which is more popular and prevalent in the public (mainstream) sphere than ever.

"A DAW that I don't like is more widely used than the one I prefer, how is that even possible, it's must be a ponzi-scheme?!" I should hope that after reading that back to yourself, after removing your tinfoil fat naturally, you will realise how mad you sound.

[DJ Warmonger]

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model.

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

And yes, Ableton marketing is good as they simply aim at different target group / production model than other "regular" DAWs.
It has nothing to do with the actual amount or quality of music produced

[HitEmTrue]

that's so easy to set up that you must pay curses to learn how to do it. Live is king of business.

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model. Feed more ad, feed more gibberish, feed more likes, sell more software, get more ad, get more likes, get paid. This statics may give us a glance into it.

Those images show that Logic is pretty much irrelevant on Instagram. Less than 2000 followers? Ableton has a high engagement rate for over 400k followers.

Ableton isn’t just a DAW. It is used to run lights. To automate/sync ProPresenter with music (on-screen lyrics, video clips). As a live keyboard plugin host, like MainStage.

FWIW, I’m a Logic and MainStage user myself.

[tooneba]

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model.

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

Calm down. It's also used for product actually sold but being sold through dubious channels. It was misused but getting broader meaning. I picked the term intentionally.

[tooneba]

that's so easy to set up that you must pay curses to learn how to do it. Live is king of business.

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model. Feed more ad, feed more gibberish, feed more likes, sell more software, get more ad, get more likes, get paid. This statics may give us a glance into it.

Ableton has a high engagement rate for over 400k followers.

No. Use magnifier and read what it says. Lower then average.

[PieBerger]

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model.

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

Calm down. It's also used for product actually sold but being sold through dubious channels. I picked the term intentionally.

Dubious channels, like marketing, which incidently are the same channels all other DAWs are sold through, except Ableton are better at it and hence sell more licenses . You are making a simple situation into something very convoluted for whatever reason. If you don't like Ableton or their products, that is perfectly fine, just be a rational adult about it, you don't have to invent weird ass conspiracy theories to reinforce your disdain towards them.

[tooneba]

that's so easy to set up that you must pay curses to learn how to do it. Live is king of business.

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model. Feed more ad, feed more gibberish, feed more likes, sell more software, get more ad, get more likes, get paid. This statics may give us a glance into it.

Wow, I've read some crazy stuff on KVR over the years, but this is just something else...

What is so hard to understand about Ableton Live simply being a popular DAW because it has a great feature set that appeals to people who want to write music quickly, in a fun and intuitive way (compared to most other DAWs) and or perform it live, particularly electronic music which is more popular and prevalent in the public (mainstream) sphere than ever.

"A DAW that I don't like is more widely used than the one I prefer, how is that even possible, it's must be a ponzi-scheme?!" I should hope that after reading that back to yourself, after removing your tinfoil fat naturally, you will realise how mad you sound.

As a user who understand the tool's strength and using the said software I don't know who your speech is meant to convey but we get your input.

[tooneba]

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model.

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

Calm down. It's also used for product actually sold but being sold through dubious channels. I picked the term intentionally.

Dubious channels, like marketing, which incidently are the same channels all other DAWs are sold through, except Ableton are better at it and hence sell more licenses . You are making a simple situation into something very convoluted for whatever reason. If you don't like Ableton or their products, that is perfectly fine, just be a rational adult about it, you don't have to invent weird ass conspiracy theories to reinforce your disdain towards them.

Ponzi scheme is also sold through physically same method as other products. So what is your point? The difference is the way how utilize it, like "Do this u get this more" Also, I think one would rather not bring personal preference if he wanted to do rational conversation. Just my 2 cents.

[PieBerger]

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model.

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

Calm down. It's also used for product actually sold but being sold through dubious channels. I picked the term intentionally.

Dubious channels, like marketing, which incidently are the same channels all other DAWs are sold through, except Ableton are better at it and hence sell more licenses . You are making a simple situation into something very convoluted for whatever reason. If you don't like Ableton or their products, that is perfectly fine, just be a rational adult about it, you don't have to invent weird ass conspiracy theories to reinforce your disdain towards them.

Ponzi scheme is also sold through same channel as other products. So what is your point? The difference is the way how utilize it, like "Do this u get this more" Also, I think one would rather not bring personal preference if he wanted to do rational conversation. Just my 2 cents.

You used a screencap of Twitter engagement of various DAW devs as an argument for Ableton running a Ponzi-like scheme, any chance of rational discussion jumped straight out of the thread then I'm afraid.

[tooneba]

It's like running on pinzi-scheme ish model.

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

Calm down. It's also used for product actually sold but being sold through dubious channels. I picked the term intentionally.

Dubious channels, like marketing, which incidently are the same channels all other DAWs are sold through, except Ableton are better at it and hence sell more licenses . You are making a simple situation into something very convoluted for whatever reason. If you don't like Ableton or their products, that is perfectly fine, just be a rational adult about it, you don't have to invent weird ass conspiracy theories to reinforce your disdain towards them.

Ponzi scheme is also sold through same channel as other products. So what is your point? The difference is the way how utilize it, like "Do this u get this more" Also, I think one would rather not bring personal preference if he wanted to do rational conversation. Just my 2 cents.

You used a screencap of Twitter engagement of various DAW devs as an argument for Ableton running a Ponzi-like scheme, any chance of rational discussion jumped straight out of the thread then I'm afraid.

If you read carefully there are no determination whether they are or not. There is an idea given by me and one example tendency that can observed as a statistics. You don't need to come to the conclusion so fast.

[dupont]

Drum Rack and Gate are both included in Lite, so yes you will be able to recreate this

Gate isn't included in Lite unfortunately, but no big deal, I just downloaded my Live 9 - I was just being lazy.

So, it took me a while to reverse engineer this. About 4/5 hours in fact. It's not so simple even when you understand the concepts, because nothing was shown HOW to do this in Ableton, only WHAT to do. Still, I figured it out.

I've made up a template for you to download and you can load it in Live 10 Lite (I've checked) but you won't be able to save. It will ask you if you want to cancel or just go ahead and load the project. Load it. The Gate plugin will mysteriously appear and you'll be able to use it, but you won't be able to save what you do. You'll need a higher version of Live. At least 'Intro' which does include Gate. You may be able to swap out the Gate though for the included Compressor that comes with Lite - I don't know, not checked if that does 'gating' as such.

I knocked this up in Live 9 Standard, so anything above that should work and you will be able to save your work. Of course you can also load in your own samples (I just included a few random ones that seemed to work ok together).

In the video, Adam Maggs also takes this concept further and uses it for triggering FX and whatnot, but I didn't get that far. This template is just for the first part of the video where he was triggering audio loops. Still, it gives you the concept and you should be able to work the rest out for yourself. This was the hard part really, if you don't 100 percent know what you are doing (and I didn't).

This is the window you should get when you load the template:



I jigged the drum rack about a bit so that Loop 1 is at the top and Loop 3 is at the bottom - it just seemed more logical that way, as opposed to them being 'upside down' in Adam's example.

I've also included some variations on the trigger devices, namely Simpler which I loaded up a white noise loop for. Changing the envelopes for the ADSR stuff obviously will shorten or lengthen the trigger time. Ideally you want a trigger time that corresponds to exactly how long the midi note plays for. But it's fun and sounds good to mess with these to 'tighten' up stuff or make it more 'legato' and drawn out.

I also included some varied presets for the Gate plugin - again, same concept. It should be enough to give you an idea. I think I got the main trigger times pretty accurate, but you can always mess with them yourselves via the ADSR controls.

The first midi lane triggers the first audio loop - channel 1, and so forth. Nothing to stop you adding more lanes. And of course this can all be triggered from a midi controller of your choice, as demonstrated by Adam in that video.

Another interesting feature of this template is the fact that the Simpler containing the white noise is muted, but when you get a pattern going, it sounds quite good to unmute it and blend it back in to the signal.

This is a great way to fill out loops with a bit of extra body. Don't be afraid to raise or lower the volume of the white noise either, it should still trigger the samples. You can even add FX such as reverb or delay if you want. I only realised they were loaded in the project a bit later, but they aren't doing any harm and you can use them if you want or set up your own FX to taste.

Here is the template:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/kig1jw2rg ... R.rar/file


All credit goes to Adam Maggs for the concept. I only worked out (best I could) how he got this all set up! It's a very creative and fun way to use Ableton - it reminded me a bit of the functionality you get in some of the Twisted Tools ensembles for Reaktor.

Anyway, it's all set up for you and you can see how it's all 'wired' together. Just load up your own samples and mess about with changing the midi notes to create your own new variations on your loops/samples.

So it seems not a simple or intuitive as other says a few posts above

[PieBerger]

Drum Rack and Gate are both included in Lite, so yes you will be able to recreate this

Gate isn't included in Lite unfortunately, but no big deal, I just downloaded my Live 9 - I was just being lazy.

So, it took me a while to reverse engineer this. About 4/5 hours in fact. It's not so simple even when you understand the concepts, because nothing was shown HOW to do this in Ableton, only WHAT to do. Still, I figured it out.

I've made up a template for you to download and you can load it in Live 10 Lite (I've checked) but you won't be able to save. It will ask you if you want to cancel or just go ahead and load the project. Load it. The Gate plugin will mysteriously appear and you'll be able to use it, but you won't be able to save what you do. You'll need a higher version of Live. At least 'Intro' which does include Gate. You may be able to swap out the Gate though for the included Compressor that comes with Lite - I don't know, not checked if that does 'gating' as such.

I knocked this up in Live 9 Standard, so anything above that should work and you will be able to save your work. Of course you can also load in your own samples (I just included a few random ones that seemed to work ok together).

In the video, Adam Maggs also takes this concept further and uses it for triggering FX and whatnot, but I didn't get that far. This template is just for the first part of the video where he was triggering audio loops. Still, it gives you the concept and you should be able to work the rest out for yourself. This was the hard part really, if you don't 100 percent know what you are doing (and I didn't).

This is the window you should get when you load the template:



I jigged the drum rack about a bit so that Loop 1 is at the top and Loop 3 is at the bottom - it just seemed more logical that way, as opposed to them being 'upside down' in Adam's example.

I've also included some variations on the trigger devices, namely Simpler which I loaded up a white noise loop for. Changing the envelopes for the ADSR stuff obviously will shorten or lengthen the trigger time. Ideally you want a trigger time that corresponds to exactly how long the midi note plays for. But it's fun and sounds good to mess with these to 'tighten' up stuff or make it more 'legato' and drawn out.

I also included some varied presets for the Gate plugin - again, same concept. It should be enough to give you an idea. I think I got the main trigger times pretty accurate, but you can always mess with them yourselves via the ADSR controls.

The first midi lane triggers the first audio loop - channel 1, and so forth. Nothing to stop you adding more lanes. And of course this can all be triggered from a midi controller of your choice, as demonstrated by Adam in that video.

Another interesting feature of this template is the fact that the Simpler containing the white noise is muted, but when you get a pattern going, it sounds quite good to unmute it and blend it back in to the signal.

This is a great way to fill out loops with a bit of extra body. Don't be afraid to raise or lower the volume of the white noise either, it should still trigger the samples. You can even add FX such as reverb or delay if you want. I only realised they were loaded in the project a bit later, but they aren't doing any harm and you can use them if you want or set up your own FX to taste.

Here is the template:

http://www.mediafire.com/file/kig1jw2rg ... R.rar/file


All credit goes to Adam Maggs for the concept. I only worked out (best I could) how he got this all set up! It's a very creative and fun way to use Ableton - it reminded me a bit of the functionality you get in some of the Twisted Tools ensembles for Reaktor.

Anyway, it's all set up for you and you can see how it's all 'wired' together. Just load up your own samples and mess about with changing the midi notes to create your own new variations on your loops/samples.

So it seems not a simple or intuitive as other says a few posts above

I did say by comparison

[PieBerger]

A "Ponzi scheme" means that no real product or profit is ever made. Ableton is definitely a real product of real value. Get over it

Calm down. It's also used for product actually sold but being sold through dubious channels. I picked the term intentionally.

Dubious channels, like marketing, which incidently are the same channels all other DAWs are sold through, except Ableton are better at it and hence sell more licenses . You are making a simple situation into something very convoluted for whatever reason. If you don't like Ableton or their products, that is perfectly fine, just be a rational adult about it, you don't have to invent weird ass conspiracy theories to reinforce your disdain towards them.

Ponzi scheme is also sold through same channel as other products. So what is your point? The difference is the way how utilize it, like "Do this u get this more" Also, I think one would rather not bring personal preference if he wanted to do rational conversation. Just my 2 cents.

You used a screencap of Twitter engagement of various DAW devs as an argument for Ableton running a Ponzi-like scheme, any chance of rational discussion jumped straight out of the thread then I'm afraid.

If you read carefully there are no determination whether they are or not. There is an idea given by me and one example tendency that can observed as a statistics. You don't need to come to the conclusion so fast.

Forgive for jumping to conclusions but it's a pretty extreme/bizarre observation to make before any other possible reasons for engagement being low, relative to the size of their following.