external synth midi CC messages in ableton

[burkowitz]

Hi everyone, first post here.

I am trying to get an understanding of how to control my external synthesizer (clavia nord lead 2) with midi and ableton live 9.

I have read the page on abletons website about setting up external instruments.. I have figured out how to record midi notes from my synth, and I am able to get the sequence to play back through my synth.

What I am confused about is how to record the Control Change messages with midi.

I have read that the synth needs to be set to "local off" and that the control change messages need to be routed through midi. This is the part that gets confusing for me.

It also says in the manual that there is an option for "PROG/CTRL ON/OFF" so if i turn CTRL on, CC data is sent and recieved, if turn it off, it isn't.

So if the synth is set to local off, I can't change the control parameters directly. but If I turn CTRL off I can change the parameters on the synth again? I am guessing CTRL is supposed to be set to on though, and some how the message is supposed to be sent to my DAW to record and then back out to my synth to actually effect the change.

In my external instrument clip envelope view i see a tab for MIDI CTRL that seems to have a list of numbered parameters that I imagine would correspond to the synth I have hooked up. If I try recording the mod wheel I can get the change to show up there but when I play it back the envelope doesn't seem to have an effect on the synth.. even though i see an envelope has been recorded. the rest of the controls on the main panel don't seem to record anything in this envelope window.. but if say i was using a VST instrument, I can easily map the controls of my synth to VST parameters, and record automation. I am trying to figure out how to record automation for the hardware synth itself though!

can anybody help me out?

[burkowitz]

with the synth set to local off, with CTRL option on, I am able to record for example the filter cutoff automation. When I play the midi sequence though, it seems like only the note data is getting through to the synth, the control automation doesn't seem to have any effect. what am I doing wrong here?

[burkowitz]

I tried posting on the Nord forums and someone is beginning to shed the light on this for me
http://www.norduserforum.com/nord-lead- ... t5676.html

But I still seem to have a basic problem with getting MIDI CCs programmed in ableton out to the nord to actually make an effect! I am confused because if my MIDI settings are set to ouput:track=on shouldn't it be sending the CC data along with the notes? only the notes are getting through.

[burkowitz]

I took out my Korg ER-1 drum machine synth which I hadn't used in a while, and decided to play with it in ableton a bit.

Of course it is a bit of a different beast compared to the Nord Lead 2 but I am able to record and play back control changes from ableton to the ER-1 without any major problems. It seems like the ER-1 always uses the same CC channel (4data) with a combination of CC 98 + 99 (if i remember this right, i closed the program a while ago) but yeah its only using that one CC channel for the automation, so if you try to record automation for more than one part, it gets over written.. I think 98+99 control which parameter is being automated by the data channel, and if you overdub 98+99 the ER-1 starts getting confused and weird things start to happen.. like parameters you didn't expect to change start changing. Thats the way I understand it at the moment anyways.

but yeah i can do midi cc control changes to the ER-1.. even if it seems a bit limited, only being able to do one at a time.. at least it seems to work. Still haven't figured out why the midi CC automation does nothing to my nord.

[burkowitz]

Problem solved!

I was trying to automate MIDI CCs on MIDI Channel 1.

that doesn't work, but I don't have any problem if I use other MIDI Channels.

Simple fix, but took me a while to think of that!

I am kind of new to MIDI so if anyone could explain why MIDI channel 1 is like this.. is it just a quirk for the nord? is this common for midi channel 1 on most machines?

but yeah figured i'd post my solution in case someone else has this problem.

[remitrom]

Thanks for sharing this.
I was having the exact same issue.
I had ABCD set up on channels 1234 (as you would)
Changing A to 5 meant I could automate.
Sheesh. Such an annoying thing ... did you ever figure out the reason why?
I thought it might be because the 'global' channel was also set to 1, but that's not it.
I don't remember reading this quirk in the manual but maybe I forgot?