No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Anything about MUSIC but doesn't fit into the forums above.
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Forgotten
KVRAF
3337 posts since 15 Apr, 2019 from Nowhere

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:10 pm

wagtunes wrote:Well let's see, shitty gigs. Hmm. Well, I can't sing. Not really. I can just about play an instrument. Certainly not well enough to play in front of people, which is why I'm trying to make it as a songwriter.

So tell me, what shitty gigs do songwriters who aren't performers take?
This is just another excuse. They just do shitty gigs. Period. That's how it works, and they don't need to be able to sing or play anything.

Lou Reed, Ray Davies and Bob Dylan could have given up as they don't have good voices and can't play instruments that well, but look at the results. The difference is, they didn't make excuses and went out and paid their dues.

I'm really not sure it's worth anyone giving you advice in response to these threads as what you really need to do is give yourself a kick up the ass or just give up now.

deastman
KVRAF
7233 posts since 7 Aug, 2003 from San Francisco Bay Area

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:12 pm

Michael L wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:48 pm
wagtunes wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:43 pm
But by all means, give me a rock bottom level of success that you would consider me being reasonable in accepting. I guarantee that I haven't even reached THAT level yet.
deastman wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:38 pm
You have to be really good at what you do. You have to network and meet people who can help you. You have to be a generally likeable person, dependable, and easy to deal with.
All of that success is within one's control.
Oh sure, just leave off the last part where I said that you need to have luck. ;)

But yeah, who is it that said something along the lines of “showing up is half the battle”? If you don’t put yourself out there, doing good work, being helpful to industry people, and getting noticed, your chances are not very good.
Incomplete list of my gear: 1/8" audio input jack.

deastman
KVRAF
7233 posts since 7 Aug, 2003 from San Francisco Bay Area

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:16 pm

As heartbreaking as cancer is, for ANYBODY, there is a higher percentage of people cured of cancer than make it in the entertainment industry.
This is really a silly debate. Wags is talking about the entertainment industry being difficult to break into as an outsider. Experimental Crow is talking about a cancer ward being a stressful and emotionally difficult place to work. You’re both talking past each other and not even about the same thing.
Incomplete list of my gear: 1/8" audio input jack.

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Benedict
KVRAF
3011 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:17 pm

Michael L wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:01 pm
Benedict wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:53 pm
Back to a useful conversation. Do this course: https://benedict
:roll:
You quoted only 2% of what I said and deliberately gutted it, and no doubt didn't even follow the link you also deliberately butchered, to see that the material offered has no cost whatsoever except for time.

Why do that? To make yourself feel powerful because I did something you are too scared to? I can't see what you have ever done but when I show something I did you get mean. Does doing that course scare you? Does my having done something you don't feel able to do offend you? If so please deal with that fear yourself instead of attacking someone who is freely offering HELP TO ALL.

:-(

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Benedict
KVRAF
3011 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:18 pm

deastman wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:16 pm
As heartbreaking as cancer is, for ANYBODY, there is a higher percentage of people cured of cancer than make it in the entertainment industry.
This is really a silly debate. Wags is talking about the entertainment industry being difficult to break into as an outsider. Experimental Crow is talking about a cancer ward being a stressful and emotionally difficult place to work. You’re both talking past each other and not even about the same thing.
This was my point about getting the conversation back on track.

Wags are you here? Is any of what people are saying here helping in any way?

:-)

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Michael L
KVRAF
2811 posts since 25 Jan, 2014 from The End of The World as We Knowit

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:36 pm

Benedict wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:18 pm
This was my point about getting the conversation back on track.
Oh I see. Sorry I misunderstood what you thought was off track. I find much of this thread quite insightful.
He is a letter to everyone
You open it
It says Live

xoxos
Mr Entertainment
12148 posts since 30 Apr, 2002 from i might peeramid

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:47 pm

deastman wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:16 pm
You’re both talking past each other and not even about the same thing.
if you haven't seen the 1987 production of dream of the red chamber, the music, and all parts, were well acclaimed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xOsK7a0t3c

the narrative itself gives perspective to the tragedies of the ages.
you come and go, you come and go. amitabha neither a follower nor a leader be tagore "where roads are made i lose my way" where there is certainty, consideration is absent.

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Benedict
KVRAF
3011 posts since 5 Mar, 2004 from Gold Coast Australia

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:51 pm

Michael L wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:36 pm
Benedict wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:18 pm
This was my point about getting the conversation back on track.
Oh I see. Sorry I misunderstood what you thought was off track. I find much of this thread quite insightful.
Thanks :-)

This is indeed very interesting if you can step back and see the fear in action. Even better if you can use that to see and change some of your own (or mine as the case may be).

Wags has talent. Wags doesn't let himself use what he has. (he ain't the only one I can tell ya)
Others step in, some offering great advice, some expressing their own fear.

My path is not too far from that of Wags except I almost got signed a few times in my youth. After that, I also felt a pariah as I watched increasingly less capable people get accolades for scrappy work - and being told I was not relevant by these people. It burns.

I still didn't "make it" BUT I have put a lot of effort into trying to help others from all the things I have learned along the way. And I have devoted the last 10 years in particular to trying to understand where my limits are/were.

Sadly I still find more people stuck in their fears & being nasty (or just clueless/lazy which comes off as the same) instead of reaching out and stepping forward.

:hug:

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wagtunes
KVRAF
16928 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:06 pm

Forgotten wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:10 pm
wagtunes wrote:Well let's see, shitty gigs. Hmm. Well, I can't sing. Not really. I can just about play an instrument. Certainly not well enough to play in front of people, which is why I'm trying to make it as a songwriter.

So tell me, what shitty gigs do songwriters who aren't performers take?
This is just another excuse. They just do shitty gigs. Period. That's how it works, and they don't need to be able to sing or play anything.

Lou Reed, Ray Davies and Bob Dylan could have given up as they don't have good voices and can't play instruments that well, but look at the results. The difference is, they didn't make excuses and went out and paid their dues.

I'm really not sure it's worth anyone giving you advice in response to these threads as what you really need to do is give yourself a kick up the ass or just give up now.
Then maybe you should just excuse yourself from this thread since I'm 5 seconds from putting you on ignore anyway.

You know NOTHING about the hell I've been through in 42 years of trying to make it in this business, the crappy bands I played in, the industry pros I met with, the tens of thousands of dollars I spent trying to "buy" a career. The only thing I didn't do was offer to sleep with someone.

But sure, go on and make all your assumptions about me when you don't know shit about me.

In fact, welcome to my ignore list.

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jacqueslacouth
KVRian
1063 posts since 18 Nov, 2004 from The Liberated People's Republic of Straya

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:09 pm

wagtunes wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:13 pm
This is without a doubt the toughest business on the planet.
Ever tried making a living as a poet? :D

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wagtunes
KVRAF
16928 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:10 pm

jacqueslacouth wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:09 pm
wagtunes wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:13 pm
This is without a doubt the toughest business on the planet.
Ever tried making a living as a poet? :D
All part of entertaining people.

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el-bo (formerly ebow)
KVRAF
13501 posts since 24 May, 2009 from A galaxy, far far away

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:18 pm

wagtunes wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:06 pm
Forgotten wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:10 pm
wagtunes wrote:Well let's see, shitty gigs. Hmm. Well, I can't sing. Not really. I can just about play an instrument. Certainly not well enough to play in front of people, which is why I'm trying to make it as a songwriter.

So tell me, what shitty gigs do songwriters who aren't performers take?
This is just another excuse. They just do shitty gigs. Period. That's how it works, and they don't need to be able to sing or play anything.

Lou Reed, Ray Davies and Bob Dylan could have given up as they don't have good voices and can't play instruments that well, but look at the results. The difference is, they didn't make excuses and went out and paid their dues.

I'm really not sure it's worth anyone giving you advice in response to these threads as what you really need to do is give yourself a kick up the ass or just give up now.
You know NOTHING about the hell I've been through in 42 years of trying to make it in this business, the crappy bands I played in, the industry pros I met with, the tens of thousands of dollars I spent trying to "buy" a career. The only thing I didn't do was offer to sleep with someone.
He doesn't need to know the details. It's you who started this thread by drawing a line in the sand - "No More Excuses". The implication being that until now you've been making excuses for your lack of success. However, if you really think you've done everything you can (Only you truly know if you've short-changed yourself), then you already have your answer :tu:

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wagtunes
KVRAF
16928 posts since 8 Oct, 2014

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:25 pm

You know, here's a thought. Everybody busting my balls that maybe I haven't "done enough" maybe I just don't have enough talent and THAT'S why I haven't made it. Maybe as a songwriter I'm average at best. Maybe THAT'S the reason and not because of anything I've done or haven't done.

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el-bo (formerly ebow)
KVRAF
13501 posts since 24 May, 2009 from A galaxy, far far away

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:28 pm

wagtunes wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:06 pm
In fact, welcome to my ignore list.
Hey man! Welcome! :hug:

Help yourself to drinks and snacks. You'll find your orientation pack under your seat. Please familiarise yourself with the rules of engagement.

We hope your stay will be pleasant and fruitful!

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Michael L
KVRAF
2811 posts since 25 Jan, 2014 from The End of The World as We Knowit

Re: No More Excuses...Please Help A Wannabe Songwriter

Post Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:28 pm

deastman wrote:
Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:12 pm
Oh sure, just leave off the last part where I said that you need to have luck. ;)
But yeah, who is it that said something along the lines of “showing up is half the battle”?
Woody Allen said "80% of life is showing up."
I am only suggesting that if you want to define success, define it in terms of those things you have control over (which does not include luck).
He is a letter to everyone
You open it
It says Live

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