So there are 2 symptoms here. Silent notes and notes shifted by 1 semitone. I have seen both of these problems, but not consistently. Next time I see this, I'll test some more setup changes. I do think that these 2 symptoms are related.
This is the only serious problem I have with EnergyXT. I have been seeing it since at least 2.5.4, but possibly longer. If this were to be fixed, I would be so happy. If it turns out to be a driver setting, I will also be happy, but I doubt that this is the case.
Which audio driver are you using?
VST(i)'s out of tune!!
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
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- KVRAF
- 4584 posts since 21 Sep, 2005
Don't forget that notes are being shifted by a semi-tone whilst inside the audio buffer and also physically by midi and showing up on the keyboard physically changing. While another vst assigned to the exact same channel does not react to this rogue controller information. Though not necessarily at the same time, if at all.seismic1 wrote:So there are 2 symptoms here. Silent notes and notes shifted by 1 semitone. I have seen both of these problems, but not consistently. Next time I see this, I'll test some more setup changes. I do think that these 2 symptoms are related.
This is the only serious problem I have with EnergyXT. I have been seeing it since at least 2.5.4, but possibly longer. If this were to be fixed, I would be so happy. If it turns out to be a driver setting, I will also be happy, but I doubt that this is the case.
Which audio driver are you using?
In this instance I am just using the latest ASIO4ALL driver. I have tried every possible setting and it might go away for a while, but always comes back - just with certain synths though. And it is very hard to reproduce the bug 100 percent - it's a true Heisenbug - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heisenbug, at least I hope it is and not a Mandelbug.
As it is affecting midi as well as audio in such an unpredictable manner, it effectively renders the project useless - scrap it and go and work on something else. Hence my poor attempt at sarcasm for Jorgen to throw us a bone. Though I knew full well that it would take a whole lot more than that to provoke the man into deeming to reply. Oh well. XT ain't the only game in town. Shame really. Do love it.
cheers.
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
Last night it happened again. A project I had been working in and save on Tuesday started misbehaving. I loaded it and played the midi and one instance of PolyIblit was 1 semitone too high. This was at about 3AM. I thought "I don't have time to mess about with this now" so I exited the project without saving and went to bed.
Tonight I loaded up the project and the same PolyIblit instance was out of tune, as expected. I shut down EnergyXT without saving the project and rebooted the machine.
After this I again loaded up the project in EnergyXT and it played with no problems.
Before each of the first two instances of the problem, my machine had been running for at least 4 hours, checking KVR, SoundCloud etc from Chrome. This is now making me think that the problem may possibly be be driver-related.
Tonight I loaded up the project and the same PolyIblit instance was out of tune, as expected. I shut down EnergyXT without saving the project and rebooted the machine.
After this I again loaded up the project in EnergyXT and it played with no problems.
Before each of the first two instances of the problem, my machine had been running for at least 4 hours, checking KVR, SoundCloud etc from Chrome. This is now making me think that the problem may possibly be be driver-related.
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- KVRAF
- 4584 posts since 21 Sep, 2005
It is almost certainly driver related.
why manifest itself in midi physically changing notes and/or audio changing the notes in the audio buffer by a semi-tone each time?
I can offer only one solution: render out all files to audio. But seeing as this manifested itself in the audio buffer by being out by the semi-tone, I'm not sure how much this would help. I do two things: I render out all midi to audio. I make a reference tone. I mark the note.
This has stopped me using xt2 finally. I needed something like this. My last sarcasm on the matter was just that. My last sarcasm. I won't bother with more. To quote the late great Jimmy Savil - it was good while it lasted. Feel the same way about XT.
Only use it now for legacy projects. I've dumped it in the bin.
I would have persevered and said: please sir can I have some more of that being beaten about the head stuff? But Jorgen the Borgen is above all that. I thought maybe he had had some kind of break down, but it turns out that he is just an arrogant *********.
You might make some pocket change out of xt j, and I suspect you have a rich g/f, but the time has now passed to lament what a great money spinner xt coulda been. You are left with fan boys and those that just can't let go.
I did what i did for the right reasons. I stuck around as much and had a good time (while it lasted
, those days are over. It's going to be a sharp curve downside from now on.
I'd like to say I wish you all the best, but i would be lying. I wish you would sort out the clusterfuck that xt has become. But you won't. It's ok.
All the best old chap.
why manifest itself in midi physically changing notes and/or audio changing the notes in the audio buffer by a semi-tone each time?
I can offer only one solution: render out all files to audio. But seeing as this manifested itself in the audio buffer by being out by the semi-tone, I'm not sure how much this would help. I do two things: I render out all midi to audio. I make a reference tone. I mark the note.
This has stopped me using xt2 finally. I needed something like this. My last sarcasm on the matter was just that. My last sarcasm. I won't bother with more. To quote the late great Jimmy Savil - it was good while it lasted. Feel the same way about XT.
Only use it now for legacy projects. I've dumped it in the bin.
I would have persevered and said: please sir can I have some more of that being beaten about the head stuff? But Jorgen the Borgen is above all that. I thought maybe he had had some kind of break down, but it turns out that he is just an arrogant *********.
You might make some pocket change out of xt j, and I suspect you have a rich g/f, but the time has now passed to lament what a great money spinner xt coulda been. You are left with fan boys and those that just can't let go.
I did what i did for the right reasons. I stuck around as much and had a good time (while it lasted
, those days are over. It's going to be a sharp curve downside from now on.I'd like to say I wish you all the best, but i would be lying. I wish you would sort out the clusterfuck that xt has become. But you won't. It's ok.
All the best old chap.
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
So last night I fired up the project that had given me the detuning problems mentioned a couple of posts ago. My machine had been running for about 6 hours, checking email, playing Soundcloud tracks and mp3s. When I opened the eXT project, I noticed that one instance of polyIblit was generating a low frequency rumble, predominantly in the right hand channel, and an instance of EVM Ultrasonique was completely disregarding its own ADSR envelope settings. I rebooted the machine and reloaded the project and everything worked as it should. I am wondering whether this may be a simple case of an unitialised block of memory.
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
I just fired up an old energyXT project, and the z3ta+ midi was playing back one semitone flat. The computer had been running for about 6 hours prior to this. I had accessed KVR, SoundCloud and a few other sites, streamed some audio, played some wav and mp3 files from my local disk. I rebooted the machine and immediately went back into the EnergyXT project. All midi from z3ta+ was now in tune.
Before encountering the z3ta+ problem, I had been into a few other EnergyXT projects. My next test will be to fire up the z3ta+ project upon first using eXT after a lengthy uptime to try to identify whether the problem is caused by another project or some external fault in the audio stack.
The thing is, when I see the problem with z3ta+, notes generated using the keyboard in the eXT tracks view are correct. Only the midi data in the grid is flat.
Before encountering the z3ta+ problem, I had been into a few other EnergyXT projects. My next test will be to fire up the z3ta+ project upon first using eXT after a lengthy uptime to try to identify whether the problem is caused by another project or some external fault in the audio stack.
The thing is, when I see the problem with z3ta+, notes generated using the keyboard in the eXT tracks view are correct. Only the midi data in the grid is flat.
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
Ok. I've just noticed a similar problem with Harmor, as reported by codec_spurt a while ago. I need to perform a few more tests to try to replicate this. this was in the latest 2.7beta2, but I'm sure the problem was present in older versions.
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- KVRist
- 62 posts since 24 Apr, 2014
it certainly is present in 2.7 beta 4 too, zeta+2 now and then plays everything a semitone high or low, and when you retune the synth, then sooner or later it goes back to normal making tuning it back neccesary. I honelst think it's the midi that does it. When it happens, ive seen the midi clip act weird too, not possible to jump back and forth right in the time line and if i jump back to a place before the midi clip, all sound stops until xt is rebooted.
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- KVRAF
- 4584 posts since 21 Sep, 2005
I don't know what is going on here, but then again, I'm not sure Jorgen does either.
We will never know.
Anyway, after a bit of research around the webz, EnergyXT2 seems to have a real problem both with Native Instruments plugins and also Image Line plugins.
For example, another well known problem is the guis of harmor and their other synths going black and blank when trying to reload - I mean just calling them up in a project as you do to adjust a parameter. Saving the project is always a good idea when you work with the Image Line synths, because when you reload, without fail, the gui comes back. It is annyoying as f**k, and makes me not use Image Line synths with XT2 any more.
Also, and this is more annoying again, because it is more random and insidious. Native Instruments synths don't work well apparently. I only have FM7, so thought it might just be me using an old VST, but no, major problems with Kontakt in XT2 as well apparently. Best avoided. The tuning thing is beyond reason, and what worries me is that sometimes I don't notice until half way into a five minute track and thinking 'wait a minute' that is not right. But for some reason I thought it sounded better. Anyone that ever thinks something sounds better when it is half a tone out of whack, needs serious musical help. I think I might be one of those people.
Just don't use Native Instruments or Image Line plugins with XT2 and you will be fine.
We will never know.
Anyway, after a bit of research around the webz, EnergyXT2 seems to have a real problem both with Native Instruments plugins and also Image Line plugins.
For example, another well known problem is the guis of harmor and their other synths going black and blank when trying to reload - I mean just calling them up in a project as you do to adjust a parameter. Saving the project is always a good idea when you work with the Image Line synths, because when you reload, without fail, the gui comes back. It is annyoying as f**k, and makes me not use Image Line synths with XT2 any more.
Also, and this is more annoying again, because it is more random and insidious. Native Instruments synths don't work well apparently. I only have FM7, so thought it might just be me using an old VST, but no, major problems with Kontakt in XT2 as well apparently. Best avoided. The tuning thing is beyond reason, and what worries me is that sometimes I don't notice until half way into a five minute track and thinking 'wait a minute' that is not right. But for some reason I thought it sounded better. Anyone that ever thinks something sounds better when it is half a tone out of whack, needs serious musical help. I think I might be one of those people.
Just don't use Native Instruments or Image Line plugins with XT2 and you will be fine.
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
It seems to be driver-independent. I've been running Z3ta+2 inside EnergyXT2.7 for a couple of hours, and it drifts out of tune by about 1 semitone, using both the ASIO and DX drivers.
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- Banned
- 7624 posts since 13 Nov, 2015 from Norway
Same here.seismic1 wrote:It seems to be driver-independent. I've been running Z3ta+2 inside EnergyXT2.7 for a couple of hours, and it drifts out of tune by about 1 semitone, using both the ASIO and DX drivers.
EnergyXT3 - LMMS - FL Studio | Roland SH201 - Waldorf Rocket | SoundCloud - Bandcamp
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- KVRAF
- 11498 posts since 13 Mar, 2009 from UK
I never got to the bottom of this. I have used Z3ta+2 in three Ext2.7 projects since I last posted on this thread, and I can't recall encountering the detune problem since then. It always seemed to occur if I opened a project after my PC had been running for a few hours, usually playing a lot of tracks from SoundCloud beforehand. A reboot would always seem to fix the problem. I wonder if it was a Chrome problem, possibly related to the flash audio player.
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- Banned
- 7624 posts since 13 Nov, 2015 from Norway
Cool. I'll try rebooting and see if the problem re occurs. Im using zeta+ thoughseismic1 wrote:I never got to the bottom of this. I have used Z3ta+2 in three Ext2.7 projects since I last posted on this thread, and I can't recall encountering the detune problem since then. It always seemed to occur if I opened a project after my PC had been running for a few hours, usually playing a lot of tracks from SoundCloud beforehand. A reboot would always seem to fix the problem. I wonder if it was a Chrome problem, possibly related to the flash audio player.
EnergyXT3 - LMMS - FL Studio | Roland SH201 - Waldorf Rocket | SoundCloud - Bandcamp
