Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

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Roger_Linn
KVRian
1295 posts since 8 Jun, 2010
Roger Linn Design

Post Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:23 am

romank2 wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:57 am
Yesterday I bought the linn drum vst from ALYJAMESLAB.

When do i get the download link?

Is there no Support?

Thx
How about contacting the maker of the product? FYI, here's a quote from Aly James Lab's website:

"Aly James Lab has no affiliation with Roger Linn and has not received any consent from Roger Linn. We do not claim to reproduce the sounds of Roger Linn s product but rather this product creates sounds inspired by Roger Linn's past products."

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Roger_Linn
KVRian
1295 posts since 8 Jun, 2010
Roger Linn Design

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:45 am

Straight2Vinyl wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:03 am
I'm definitely a little envious of Linnstrument users. I love the look of the layout as it's something totally different from a piano and would likely lead to different musical choices. Also, it's probably fantastic for deeply sampled guitar instruments like Amplesound and Orange Tree.
Sadly out of my price range though. The one thing leading me to picking up a Seaboard 49 is the price. Particularly with the occasional sales.

Given the lack of stores carrying Linnstrument in Canada I'm not likely to ever see one used here, but if I did I'd be all over it. Just an awesome looking product from one of hip hop and electronic musics most important figures.
Hi Straight2vinyl,

I'm sorry I can't make LinnStrument less expensive. It turns out to be pretty expensive to make a professional-quality musical instrument with polyphonic 3D touch sensing, high sensitivity, low latency and a large playing surface. Perhaps the price can come down in future as general public dissatisfaction with on/off switches becomes more widespread and therefore higher sales can permit lower prices. I hope so.

You mentioned that the Seaboard 49 is less expensive but that's not correct. In the U.S., the 4-octave Seaboard 49 is $1099 whereas the 4-octave LinnStrument 128 is $999.

Also, I would encourage you to search for "LinnStrument vs. Seaboard" to get an independent comparison of the two instruments.

I do regret that LinnStrument is available in few stores to try out, which is largely a result of the shift from local stores to internet stores. That's why I offer to connect potential buyers with local LinnStrument owners, who are usually more than happy to show their LinnStrument. If you'd care to email me at support[at]rogerlinndesign.com with your city of residence, there's a good chance that one or more of the 1700+ LinnStrument owners lives in your area and is willing to show you his.

fluffy_little_something
KVRAF
12921 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:54 am

I got Aly James' Simmons plugin and remember that he is not exactly the "most online" person around, to put it mildly. You might have to show some patience.

Straight2Vinyl
KVRist
307 posts since 10 Mar, 2017

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:30 am

Roger_Linn wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:45 am
Straight2Vinyl wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:03 am
I'm definitely a little envious of Linnstrument users. I love the look of the layout as it's something totally different from a piano and would likely lead to different musical choices. Also, it's probably fantastic for deeply sampled guitar instruments like Amplesound and Orange Tree.
Sadly out of my price range though. The one thing leading me to picking up a Seaboard 49 is the price. Particularly with the occasional sales.

Given the lack of stores carrying Linnstrument in Canada I'm not likely to ever see one used here, but if I did I'd be all over it. Just an awesome looking product from one of hip hop and electronic musics most important figures.
Hi Straight2vinyl,

I'm sorry I can't make LinnStrument less expensive. It turns out to be pretty expensive to make a professional-quality musical instrument with polyphonic 3D touch sensing, high sensitivity, low latency and a large playing surface. Perhaps the price can come down in future as general public dissatisfaction with on/off switches becomes more widespread and therefore higher sales can permit lower prices. I hope so.

You mentioned that the Seaboard 49 is less expensive but that's not correct. In the U.S., the 4-octave Seaboard 49 is $1099 whereas the 4-octave LinnStrument 128 is $999.

Also, I would encourage you to search for "LinnStrument vs. Seaboard" to get an independent comparison of the two instruments.

I do regret that LinnStrument is available in few stores to try out, which is largely a result of the shift from local stores to internet stores. That's why I offer to connect potential buyers with local LinnStrument owners, who are usually more than happy to show their LinnStrument. If you'd care to email me at support[at]rogerlinndesign.com with your city of residence, there's a good chance that one or more of the 1700+ LinnStrument owners lives in your area and is willing to show you his.
Yes a Linnatrument 128 is competitively priced, but I have really only seen it used with single hand playing. I'd at least want the option to use two which I think makes the full size linnstrument the better option in my own personal opinion. And I dont mean the price as a negative as much as just a statement of fact. As you said it's a question of demand and Roli is making a keyboard based instrument which at least makes it a safer proposition to retailers. It's a lot easier to justify 1499.99 CAD for a midi controller in a familiar layout than a 1999.99 controller with an unusual layout for a midi controller with lesser included software content. Of course this is just regular retail price and they have had at least 2 sales so far that I'm aware of. Obviously easier to do with a larger company and more demand.
As for quality, the Roli feels pretty darn sturdy as well.
If price was a non factor I'd likely get the Linnstrument. Being able to play a guitar shape with the note per channel setting looks very cool not to mention the pitch slides looking a little easier to execute.

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Roger_Linn
KVRian
1295 posts since 8 Jun, 2010
Roger Linn Design

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:47 am

Yes, it's true that the larger LinnStrument model provides more space for two-handed play. The Roli is very good design and does provide familiarity for keyboardists. I'm sure you'll be happy with it and I thank you for considering LinnStrument in your decision.

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pdxindy
KVRAF
16015 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:31 pm

Straight2Vinyl wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:30 am
Yes a Linnatrument 128 is competitively priced, but I have really only seen it used with single hand playing.
I've got the Linnstrument 128 and it does not feel small for playing. It looks small because the mind thinks of keyboards in a linear manner, but it still has 128 notes compared to 49 for the larger Rise.

I went with the 128 because I was traveling a lot at the time and it drops right in a backpack. I'm planning on getting a large Linnstrument as well. The 2 reasons I would like the larger one is because there is more room for bending notes without having to have as much foresight as to which row you are starting on. Second is to have 2 of them for playing multiple synths in realtime. The 128 is a bit small for doing splits so the larger one also has an advantage there. Otherwise I am quite happy with the 128...

tapper mike
KVRAF
5066 posts since 20 Jan, 2008

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Mon Nov 19, 2018 4:57 pm

While I can't comment on bend/slide. It's actually quite easy to get mileage out of 4-5 columns / frets.

bkanzelmeyer
KVRer
6 posts since 27 Sep, 2017

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:53 am

GruvSyco wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:01 pm
Anderton wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:44 pm
GruvSyco wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:58 am
Can the linnstrument do scales without spaces? I love grid controllers and love this feature on the Push.

As Roger pointed out, no. However, somewhat of a workaround is that some DAWs and MIDI plug-ins allow constraining input to particular scales. So even if you hit a note "between the spaces," it will end up in the space of a particular scale/key. Not the same thing as what you want, but in some cases, may obtain the desired results.
Thanks for the additional reply Craig. I'm shopping new controllers at the moment and appreciate all the input.
I can describe one possible scenario for this to happen.

1. Acquire Scala (http://www.huygens-fokker.org/scala/), a freeware, very powerful program for defining scales that is capable of outputting .tun and .mid scale definition files, among other things. In Scala, define the exact flavor of 12 EDO (Equal Divisions of the Octave) that you want, major, minor, modal, etc and then define the key by specifying the fundamental or base frequency (Scala has over 4,000 predefined scales already available, and what you are looking for may already be there). Name this scale as D Major, for example, and create a .mid file.

2. Download a VSTi plugin that can import scale definition files, like Xen-arts (http://xen-arts.net/xen-arts-32-bit-vsti/), very nice freeware synths and Soundfont player and synth. These VSTi plugins play nicely with Bitwig, although they are not MPE compliant. The scale definition .mid file can then be loaded into IVOR2, for example, a great subtractive FM synth, in Bitwig, and presto, consecutive pads on the LinnStrument play only D major.

I believe/hope that the ability to import tuning files into DAWs and plugins will become more commonplace in the future, but even so, there are many ways currently to experiment and work with microtonal scales. And the Linnstrument is absolutely the most powerful MIDI input device available today to work with alternative musical scales.

deastman
KVRAF
7231 posts since 7 Aug, 2003 from San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:27 pm

A few weeks ago I went completely off the rails and purchased a Haken Continuum. So I now own a Continuum, LinnStrument, Seaboard, and Touche. And I'm not particularly talented on any of them! The only logical conclusion that can be reached from this is the fact that I have more money than sense. And a lot less money than I did before I started this little adventure!

Nevertheless, I think this puts me in a pretty good position to assess the relative merits of the various controllers. I've already done that to a certain extent earlier in this conversation, so this is more of an update.

The Continuum is amazing. If you have piles of cash lying around, you should get one. It is incredibly sensitive, and that comes paired with a very unique and powerful internal synthesis engine, designed from the ground up to utilize the raw touch data. My intention is to use mine strictly with the internal synth, and possibly as a CV controller for my modular somewhere down the line.

If you aren't willing to go to that extreme, I think the LinnStrument is still the winner here. I've found that I love the grid layout with guitar voicing. It offers a totally different approach to the traditional piano layout found on both the Continuum and the Seaboard. The touch response is fantastic. This is now my go-to controller for in the box synths. It plays amazingly well with the Audio Modeling instruments, Cypher 2, Equator, and really most other synths if you don't need MPE.

Touche is an incredibly responsive alternative to a traditional pitch and mod wheel. I'm now using it exclusively as a live CV source in my modular, and not using it with MIDI at all. I find it too much of a nuisance to use their PC-based host application and custom patches prepared for various synths.

I'm sorry to say that the Seaboard Rise 49 is the loser here. Don't get me wrong, it's still a nice controller. If you can't afford anything else, you won't regret getting it. But the complaints I've had all along still persist: the unsatisfactory onset of z-pressure which prevents me from gracefully easing into and out of notes; the tendency when bending up or down from one note to the next for it to abruptly trigger the next note instead of continuing the pitch bend.

Just my two cents...
Incomplete list of my gear: 1/8" audio input jack.

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Roger_Linn
KVRian
1295 posts since 8 Jun, 2010
Roger Linn Design

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:15 am

deastman wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:27 pm
The Continuum is amazing. If you have piles of cash lying around, you should get one.
I agree about Continuum. It's a beautiful and fine musical instrument. Regarding the required piles of cash, are you aware of the new low-cost ContinuuMini?:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/16 ... ntinuumini

deastman
KVRAF
7231 posts since 7 Aug, 2003 from San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:54 am

Roger_Linn wrote:
Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:15 am
deastman wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:27 pm
The Continuum is amazing. If you have piles of cash lying around, you should get one.
I agree about Continuum. It's a beautiful and fine musical instrument. Regarding the required piles of cash, are you aware of the new low-cost ContinuuMini?:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/16 ... ntinuumini
Yes, the Continuumini was what started me down that particularly slippery slope which only ended once I had a proper half size Continuum in my possession. ;)
Incomplete list of my gear: 1/8" audio input jack.

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pdxindy
KVRAF
16015 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:17 am

deastman wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:27 pm
The Continuum is amazing. If you have piles of cash lying around, you should get one. It is incredibly sensitive, and that comes paired with a very unique and powerful internal synthesis engine, designed from the ground up to utilize the raw touch data. My intention is to use mine strictly with the internal synth, and possibly as a CV controller for my modular somewhere down the line.

If you aren't willing to go to that extreme, I think the LinnStrument is still the winner here. I've found that I love the grid layout with guitar voicing. It offers a totally different approach to the traditional piano layout found on both the Continuum and the Seaboard. The touch response is fantastic. This is now my go-to controller for in the box synths. It plays amazingly well with the Audio Modeling instruments, Cypher 2, Equator, and really most other synths if you don't need MPE.
I recently bought the half sized Continuum as well.

It is indeed incredibly sensitive. The feel of the surface was not what I expected after watching various videos (that is not a bad thing :)). I am also planning to use it mainly as a standalone hardware synth. I don't 100% love the internal synth engine. I would say the basic sonic quality is a step down from my favorite VST synths. Of course it is amazingly expressive, but the engine often has some 'digitalness' to it. So I consider it something of a tradeoff with the expressiveness making it worth it. I have not even begun to do any sound design yet so I might well find more sounds that satisfy me. I also have not tried using it as a controller for VST synths.

The Continuum is excellent for sounds where you are using pressure a lot. For quick plucks and strikes, I find it a bit hard to play because it is more about the pressure, not the initial strike. I think that will improve with more practice but the different designs lend themselves to different results.

I also find the Y axis on the Continuum not entirely pleasing. With more pressure, the Y axis is smooth and even... really good. But with a very light touch it isn't as much. A quirky, beautiful instrument it is.

If I could only have one or the other, I would take the Linnstrument over the Continuum. It is so versatile, so easy to use and configure right on the surface and it meets a wide variety of needs effectively. It does all that while being plenty expressive. Roger has done a brilliant job with the Linnstrument!

Having the Continuum, it made me think that it would be interesting if Roger made a second controller more aimed at pressure driven sounds with a softer more squishy surface offering highly subtle control over Z axis. I think it is not possible to have one device be able to do everything well... just as a flute and a guitar have different strengths as controllers.

I doubt however that there is yet enough of a market to make that financially viable... so just thinking out loud here :hihi:

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Tj Shredder
KVRAF
3074 posts since 6 Jan, 2017 from Outer Space

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:59 am

pdxindy wrote:
Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:17 am
Having the Continuum, it made me think that it would be interesting if Roger made a second controller more aimed at pressure driven sounds with a softer more squishy surface offering highly subtle control over Z axis. I think it is not possible to have one device be able to do everything well... just as a flute and a guitar have different strengths as controllers.

I doubt however that there is yet enough of a market to make that financially viable... so just thinking out loud here :hihi:
I had the same thought after I received my LinnStrument, as I had a past experience with a Continuum (but never could afford it).
Now, since I got very used to my beloved LinnStrument, I don't think so anymore! The advantage of the hard surface is clearly the better control for any percussive/finger drumming style of playing. There is a clear distinct point you hit and you get a precise physical feedback into your finger. That there is no "depth" when applying pressure is not much of a disadvantage. I simply got used to it and I am sure the amount of control is the same as if it would be softer...

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pdxindy
KVRAF
16015 posts since 3 Feb, 2005 from in the wilds

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Thu Dec 13, 2018 11:51 am

Tj Shredder wrote:
Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:59 am
pdxindy wrote:
Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:17 am
Having the Continuum, it made me think that it would be interesting if Roger made a second controller more aimed at pressure driven sounds with a softer more squishy surface offering highly subtle control over Z axis. I think it is not possible to have one device be able to do everything well... just as a flute and a guitar have different strengths as controllers.

I doubt however that there is yet enough of a market to make that financially viable... so just thinking out loud here :hihi:
I had the same thought after I received my LinnStrument, as I had a past experience with a Continuum (but never could afford it).
Now, since I got very used to my beloved LinnStrument, I don't think so anymore! The advantage of the hard surface is clearly the better control for any percussive/finger drumming style of playing. There is a clear distinct point you hit and you get a precise physical feedback into your finger. That there is no "depth" when applying pressure is not much of a disadvantage. I simply got used to it and I am sure the amount of control is the same as if it would be softer...
I don't want to change my Linnstrument either. I was talking about in addition to, not a replacement of.

And this last... "I simply got used to it and I am sure the amount of control is the same as if it would be softer..."

You clearly have forgotten playing the Continuum if you are saying that.

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Pictus
KVRist
277 posts since 21 Aug, 2017 from Brasil

Re: Roger Linn Design LinnStrument - by Craig Anderton

Post Thu Dec 13, 2018 3:26 pm

Found an interesting video...
https://youtu.be/Q7Akmmt59TY

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