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Bitwig on ARM processors?
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 48 posts since 27 Sep, 2004 from Berlin
Hey devs, I'm wondering how much feasible it would be to port Bitwig's codebase to ARM64 for running on upcoming ARM Windows laptops? (such as Surface Pro X). Just out of curiosity...
- KVRian
- 1289 posts since 7 Dec, 2017
Might want to contact them directly. They don't often post here.
http://www.bitwig.com/en/support/tech-support.html
http://www.bitwig.com/en/support/tech-support.html
-JH
- Banned
- 11467 posts since 4 Jan, 2017 from Warsaw, Poland
There's already Windows tablets / laptops on ARM processors, so - as long as its normal version of Windows - I don't think it matters what silicone is inside...
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Windows-o ... 796.0.html
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- KVRist
- 401 posts since 27 Mar, 2019 from stuck in Russia
what matters is instructions that processor supports, if Bitwig relies on some that aren't available on ARM processors, then I doubt they would even bother.
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- KVRist
- 363 posts since 29 Mar, 2017
The ARM emulation on Windows doesn't support 64 bit applications. I think this may mean bitwig is out of the question, not sure though.
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- KVRist
- 68 posts since 8 Feb, 2015
The Windows 10 ARM-based PCs FAQ:
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/hel ... m-based-pc
states:
"- Drivers for hardware, games and apps will only work if they're designed for a Windows 10 ARM-based PC.
- 64-bit (x64) apps won’t work. You'll need 64-bit (ARM64) apps, 32-bit (ARM32) apps, or 32-bit (x86) apps. You can usually find 32-bit (x86) versions of apps, but some app developers only offer 64-bit (x64) apps."
Current Bitwig code is 64bit (x64), so that seems to imply it will not run on Windows on ARM. Moreover, drivers for audio interfaces etc would also need to be made available for ARM.
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/hel ... m-based-pc
states:
"- Drivers for hardware, games and apps will only work if they're designed for a Windows 10 ARM-based PC.
- 64-bit (x64) apps won’t work. You'll need 64-bit (ARM64) apps, 32-bit (ARM32) apps, or 32-bit (x86) apps. You can usually find 32-bit (x86) versions of apps, but some app developers only offer 64-bit (x64) apps."
Current Bitwig code is 64bit (x64), so that seems to imply it will not run on Windows on ARM. Moreover, drivers for audio interfaces etc would also need to be made available for ARM.
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- KVRist
- 33 posts since 3 Nov, 2016
Support came back with the following
it's a topic that we have been discussing, but there's no actual roadmap for it.
Sorry that I can't give you any more reliable information on it at this point..!
At least they are thinking about but can't imagine it is too high on the priority list for now.
it's a topic that we have been discussing, but there's no actual roadmap for it.
Sorry that I can't give you any more reliable information on it at this point..!
At least they are thinking about but can't imagine it is too high on the priority list for now.
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- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 48 posts since 27 Sep, 2004 from Berlin
Interesting! Yeah it's probably a bit ahead of time as soundcards wouldn't work on ARM for now...
- KVRian
- 987 posts since 6 Jun, 2016 from San Marcos, Texas
ARM is a weird prospect; it's the majority upon mobile devices, yet server and workstation it's not. Thus, high-powered ARM offerings are few by comparison to x86.
Bitwig is not a mobile app, so until the market shifts in a big way toward ARM for workstation/server, I don't think the prospect looks good.
That said, I'm quite fond of ARM SoCs like Raspberry Pi. I'd love to run rich audio apps on my Pi for various projects. Though, the power isn't there for these devices yet. Bitwig would seize up even if it could run on it.
For instance, I have a MOD DUO, which is an ARM based guitar effects pedal. It's an incredible product and I love it. It's highly optimized, yet still, it's ARM proc (2017 gen, sorry I don't have the model offhand) is quite underpowered for what I'd like to do--which, granted is perhaps a bit much.
It's about adoption though. Linus Torvalds had some interesting things to say about ARM lately: https://www.zdnet.com/article/what-linu ... rocessors/
Bitwig is not a mobile app, so until the market shifts in a big way toward ARM for workstation/server, I don't think the prospect looks good.
That said, I'm quite fond of ARM SoCs like Raspberry Pi. I'd love to run rich audio apps on my Pi for various projects. Though, the power isn't there for these devices yet. Bitwig would seize up even if it could run on it.
For instance, I have a MOD DUO, which is an ARM based guitar effects pedal. It's an incredible product and I love it. It's highly optimized, yet still, it's ARM proc (2017 gen, sorry I don't have the model offhand) is quite underpowered for what I'd like to do--which, granted is perhaps a bit much.
It's about adoption though. Linus Torvalds had some interesting things to say about ARM lately: https://www.zdnet.com/article/what-linu ... rocessors/
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- KVRian
- 1479 posts since 19 Aug, 2009
Actually I would find as interesting to see some preparations for OpenPower or RISC-V processor as are both open source ISA, with both some open source processors already released.
You can even find Power based workstations https://raptorcs.com/
You can even find Power based workstations https://raptorcs.com/
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- KVRist
- 120 posts since 1 Nov, 2010
I'm pretty sure some of the most performant code for BWS is written in ASM and as such is highly platform-dependent, so I don't think this will be a possibility with a high likelyhood in the (near) future, especially considering ARM's diversity of architecture/hardware.
((( ~ )))
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- KVRian
- 1479 posts since 19 Aug, 2009
I doubt it, they said that the Grid devices compile for each CPU when they are installed on.wavedigit wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:02 pm I'm pretty sure some of the most performant code for BWS is written in ASM and as such is highly platform-dependent, so I don't think this will be a possibility with a high likelyhood in the (near) future, especially considering ARM's diversity of architecture/hardware.
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- KVRist
- 120 posts since 1 Nov, 2010
I might be wrong but there's a difference between JIT compiling for a (subset) of supported instructions for either specific Intel or AMD 64-bit CPUs and compiling for an entirely different architecture.pc999 wrote: ↑Sun Oct 13, 2019 3:51 pmI doubt it, they said that the Grid devices compile for each CPU when they are installed on.wavedigit wrote: ↑Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:02 pm I'm pretty sure some of the most performant code for BWS is written in ASM and as such is highly platform-dependent, so I don't think this will be a possibility with a high likelyhood in the (near) future, especially considering ARM's diversity of architecture/hardware.
((( ~ )))
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- KVRian
- 1479 posts since 19 Aug, 2009
That I dont know.