u-he view on vcv

[whyterabbyt]

Due to VCV Rack I see no point in doing any further modular software, other than maybe for the fun of it. I won't be able to pay my employees' salaries from designing and selling modular synthesizer software. Whatever we put out, there'll be someone saying "... but VCV Rack". And yes, they're right. It's pointless. Most other, if not all, softsynths resembling modular synthesizers will simply decay into oblivion, regardless if they're better or not.

Hmm. Three decades of '...but Linux', two decades of '...but GIMP' and '...but Blender' and a decade of '...but Reaper' havent actually made them thereplacement for Windows, Photoshop, Maya, ProTools et al that's being implied, though.

[Urs]

Due to VCV Rack I see no point in doing any further modular software, other than maybe for the fun of it. I won't be able to pay my employees' salaries from designing and selling modular synthesizer software. Whatever we put out, there'll be someone saying "... but VCV Rack". And yes, they're right. It's pointless. Most other, if not all, softsynths resembling modular synthesizers will simply decay into oblivion, regardless if they're better or not.

Hmm. Three decades of '...but Linux', two decades of '...but GIMP' and '...but Blender' and a decade of '...but Reaper' havent actually made them thereplacement for Windows, Photoshop, Maya, ProTools et al that's being implied, though.

True, but I guess I'm having an autumn day

[perfumer]

But how would you feel if your work was compared to an illegal file sharing platform that is credited with destroying the music industry, at least the ability for that industry to generate sustainable, living wages?

Coke in the morning, and coke in the daytime, and coke in the evening, day after day, after DAY. And coke is not Coca-Cola, coke is cocaine - for you and your mates, and your whores, and their friends. That's a sustainable living income for the music industry. Guys with close to zero music talent living like princes.

u-he is all for the money, because he has throats to feed. Anything free is anathema for this douche. He is selling a compressor for Linux OS for EUR 130. Linux OS is FREE, Reaper DAW is USD 60, his compressor for linux is EUR 130.

Try to put that in perspective.

[Urs]

Man, coke isn't doing you any good...

[chk071]

Windows And Mac OS are free too. Just so you know.

But, what is that supposed to tell anyway?

[EvilDragon]

W10 Pro or Enterprise are not free...

[chk071]

Win 10 Pro is quasi free, if you happen to have a Win 7 or 8 Pro key lying around.

My point is, noone does a great amount of money with consumer operating systems anymore. Again, though, whyever that would be relevant in this case.

[mcbpete]

Coke in the morning, and coke in the daytime, and coke in the evening, day after day, after DAY. And coke is not Coca-Cola, coke is cocaine - for you and your mates, and your whores, and their friends. That's a sustainable living income for the music industry. Guys with close to zero music talent living like princes.

u ok hun ?

[fmr]

The only thing that makes sense is creating modules for VCV rack itself. But in my opinion that train has passed as well. With 1000+ modules available, we're too late. That game is over, unless we produce super cheap, i.e. repackage stuff we have for super low prices. But that might water down our reputation and thus sales of other products. Not sure if I want to take that risk.

I don't agree. Let's look at Blamsoft. Their modules are not "that" cheap. The F-35 filter costs $25, and the Wave oscillator costs $30

With your reputation, you could very well charge something like $20 for the Moog ladder filter (which would be a port of the code included in DIVA), and about the same for the Roland filter (just two examples).

Let's say you would sell all the DIVA modules separately, charging $20 for each module. Five different oscillators would mean $100. Five different filters (or four, if you would bundle the two Korg like filters) would mean another $80. The Roland envelopes (bundled) another $20. The FX (as a bundle) another $20. I already count $200. It's more than the price of DIVA itself. And you could do the same with modules from Bazille, for example. I dont' think that your customer base wpould exactly overlap sou, you would be even broadening the user base, and conquering potential new customers. You could even sweeten the deal by creating bundles of several moduels (like DIVA oscs, DIVA filters, Bazille oscs, etc.).

It doesn't seem such a bad deal to me

[Distorted Horizon]

Man, coke isn't doing you any good...

Urs riding a chariot pulled by cats, cares for your teeth

[S0lo]

Due to VCV Rack I see no point in doing any further modular software, other than maybe for the fun of it. I won't be able to pay my employees' salaries from designing and selling modular synthesizer software. Whatever we put out, there'll be someone saying "... but VCV Rack". And yes, they're right. It's pointless. Most other, if not all, softsynths resembling modular synthesizers will simply decay into oblivion, regardless if they're better or not.

The only thing that makes sense is creating modules for VCV rack itself. But in my opinion that train has passed as well. With 1000+ modules available, we're too late. That game is over, unless we produce super cheap, i.e. repackage stuff we have for super low prices. But that might water down our reputation and thus sales of other products. Not sure if I want to take that risk.

I can't count how many times I had the same thoughts. But latter, I'm thinking, SynthEdit, SynthMaker, Reaktor. How many free modules and plugs has been made there and yet pro plugins are still selling aren't they.

I have a little theory. If a product is convincing enough, it will sell. It's not enough if its superior, it's not enough if it's actually better. Yet its enough if it's convincing. As bad as this might sound, I think it's true. May be i'm wrong.

I do agree however that VCV has in away hindered a considerable percentage of potential software modular market, Even stabbed itself to an extent.

Moderate competition is good for the market, but I think extreme competition brings the market down cause the dev can no longer survive. Free and open source can simulate extreme competition. It's good for the consumer in the short term, but less good on the long term because you end up getting too many half baked or none pro stuff. Thats not to say that free and open source can't be pro level, sure it can but it puts higher pressure on the payed developer to be even better, at a certain point he might give up.

[EvilDragon]

I think VCV's main problems are CPU consumption even with an empty rack, but also per module. Apparently there's a lot of housekeeping done per module and this increases CPU usage from what it could be in a well-optimized single plugin (we all know u-he cares about optimization). And no official VST of course that is not bridge-based, but bsp804 did that port which is at least very nice. But that's a different fork with a life of its own...

[bsp804]

[..]I guess I'm having an autumn day

With all respect, Urs, I think you actually do. It's dark and gloomy outside, raining all the time, so I can relate to that.

Snap out of it and focus on Zebra 3, I'm sure it's going to be amazing !

I like (VCV-)Rack a lot (that's why I created the VeeSeeVSTRack plugin. now also on Linux, btw), but my gut feeling is that it's a niche product tailored towards synth geeks (like us), not the huge crowd of musicians who want a vast library of high quality presets, and hey, polyphony!

[perpetual3]

But how would you feel if your work was compared to an illegal file sharing platform that is credited with destroying the music industry, at least the ability for that industry to generate sustainable, living wages?

Coke in the morning, and coke in the daytime, and coke in the evening, day after day, after DAY. And coke is not Coca-Cola, coke is cocaine - for you and your mates, and your whores, and their friends. That's a sustainable living income for the music industry. Guys with close to zero music talent living like princes.

u-he is all for the money, because he has throats to feed. Anything free is anathema for this douche. He is selling a compressor for Linux OS for EUR 130. Linux OS is FREE, Reaper DAW is USD 60, his compressor for linux is EUR 130.

Try to put that in perspective.

I don’t follow. My post that you quoted was referring to VCV rack being compared to Napster.

And I actually worked in the music industry in LA, in Santa Monica at Hans Zimmer’s Remote Control. There is a lot of talent that isn’t partying their life away over there. Too much talent. Crazy talent.

[vurt]

Man, coke isn't doing you any good...

Urs riding a chariot pulled by cats, cares for your teeth

that's fast becoming the most seen meme on the whole interweb!!!