KVR Audio

gentleclockdivider · Post by **gentleclockdivider** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:25 pm

-quote-
Sheesh. Ok. Only because you do something legal and for free and with all the passion and all that... does not mean I need to like it.

I didn't like mp3 and what it did, and I don't like VCVR and what it does (e.g. makes people ask for free u-he stuff, because why should they pay when they can have VCVR for free).

So there you have it. From my perspective, VCVR is like Napster, but for Eurorack. You don't need to like my opinion, but I'm certainly allowed to have it, no?

-unquote-

Topic is locked an can be found here .
viewtopic.php?f=31&t=508705
Reason why I created a new topic about it , because u-he can not lock it ,, and secondly I think it's a verry arrogant comment on his part .
First of all , using vcv rack doesn't mean that all users expect free stuff , noppes , the framework is free and lot's of users are willing to invest in commercial vcv plugins , and I am sure more developers will jump on board
Comparing vcv rac to napster is just an idiot thing to say , seriously .. I suspect u-he is somehow a lill bit pissed that vcv rack too his thunder for the (if ever ) upcoming berlin modular .

The sheer arrogance ...
VCV FTW !

thecontrolcentre · Post by **thecontrolcentre** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:36 pm

kmonkey · Post by **kmonkey** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:37 pm

Yeah right he is pissed right....totally...right.

Look if previous thread is locked it does not mean you need to start another one because quite frankly he was right. He does not need to like your opinion and you can do the same - not like what he has to say. Without imagining things like he is pissed. I mean come on. Pass on without dramatization and subthreads. Like first time was not enough for you or something.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:00 pm

u-he is a business with 16 people. I absolutely understand Urs' point, it's not arrogance, it's just business, NHF.

viewtopic.php?p=7132810#p7132810

VariKusBrainZ · Post by **VariKusBrainZ** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:04 pm

but you can charge for VCV modules if you want

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:12 pm

But would it be valid to risk development time just to see if it would sell better than their current product range? I don't think it would.

AnX · Post by **AnX** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:18 pm

Berlin modular?

Yeah, never gonna happen. Its a mythical beast...

I can see why urs doesnt want to get caught up in another 3rd party software format tho, after the RE fiasco.

Prob best to keep it all in house and concentrate on 'current' products.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:20 pm

generaldiomedes · Post by **generaldiomedes** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:25 pm

I just don't think VCV rack's DAW integration is ever going to be that great (I could be proven wrong) so from my point of view Reaktor with its user modules is all the modular I will need for the foreseeable future.

AnX · Post by **AnX** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:26 pm

VCVR reminds me of Napster, but for Eurorack modules.

Funny, eurorack reminds me of napster, but for moog/buchla

perpetual3 · Post by **perpetual3** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:55 pm

EvilDragon wrote:But would it be valid to risk development time just to see if it would sell better than their current product range? I don't think it would.

But that wasn’t his argument.

He said that he doesn’t like VCVR because he views it as a platform that differed from illegal file sharing only in the sense that it is illegal, but that it’s effect will be to devalue Eurorack the way that illegal mp3 devalued music sales. Which ignores the fact that there are modules which aren’t free but paid, including from the developer of VCVR himself.

Which begs the question, then, why virtual instruments in general don’t devalue the hardware market. There are lots of free and very cheap, high quality plugins, especially analog emulations. (DISCLAIMER: I own some of them, including Repro and Diva. I also bought Filterscape when it was first released, and Uhbik RE.) Yet, haven’t we seen and continue to see a hardware renaissance? Aren’t some of those synthesizers and hardware processors extremely expensive? And aren’t some companies, if not thriving, at least successful enough to make a decent living for its owners and employees? Perhaps it’s only my perspective, but it seems that way.

Of course, Urs is entitled to his opinion that he doesn’t like VCVR. But shutting down the thread, especially after expressing such a provocative opinion, well, it’s not a good look. But since English isn’t his native language, I give him the benefit of the doubt.

Now, if the argument would have been that U-He doesn’t have the resources to devote to a new, niche format, nor the desire after the RE experience, that would be different. It would make the basis for his opinion seem more reasonable then the comparison to Napster. But he didn’t do that. To put that reason into his mouth after the fact doesn’t change his initial opinion.

For the record I have VCVR, as well as Reaktor and the Softube Modular, which I bought after I used VCVR.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:58 pm

To be honest, i can understand Urs' point of view. There's a lot of "everything has to be free" attitude these days, in regards to software. And, stuff like VCVR definitely devalues other software. What does the developer live on anyway? Unemployment benefit? He can hardly make enough money with VCVR, licensing, or whatever.

Anyway, i don't think this is a fair discussion. He was asked whether u-he would do anything for VCVR, he said they wouldn't, and that he doesn't like the concept. No big deal IMO.

perpetual3 · Post by **perpetual3** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:13 pm

chk071 wrote:To be honest, i can understand Urs' point of view. There's a lot of "everything has to be free" attitude these days, in regards to software. And, stuff like VCVR definitely devalues other software. What does the developer live on anyway? Unemployment benefit? He can hardly make enough money with VCVR, licensing, or whatever.

Anyway, i don't think this is a fair discussion. He was asked whether u-he would do anything for VCVR, he said they wouldn't, and that he doesn't like the concept. No big deal IMO.

But that’s not the point - VCV modules don’t HAVE to be free. You can sell modules for VCV. VCV certainly did not devalue other software for me, in the same way that software has not devalued hardware, but that’s my opinion. If anything, many people share this opinion, as it seems that hardware market has gone up in value. I remember the time when the only analog synths you could buy were vintage or the Alesis Andromeda A6.

You’re right, of course - he doesn’t have to like the concept nor support it. But how would you feel if your work was compared to an illegal file sharing platform that is credited with destroying the music industry, at least the ability for that industry to generate sustainable, living wages?

VariKusBrainZ · Post by **VariKusBrainZ** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:18 pm

Does Urs feel the same about all freeware?

Quite a few of us here started on freeware until we grew up and got better paying jobs so we could afford to pay his wages

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sun Jul 29, 2018 7:25 pm

perpetual3 wrote:But that’s not the point - VCV modules don’t HAVE to be free. You can sell modules for VCV.

See other Urs' post I linked. He doesn't see the revenue stream there compared to what the work involved would entail. It's a valid point, besides not liking the system, and especially after being burned on Rack Extensions beforehand.

u-he view on vcv