User Ratings system overhaul?

Any problems with the site? How can we improve KVR?
Topiness
KVRist
379 posts since 21 Nov, 2005

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:47 am

In the year or so i've been on KVR, i haven't noticed many new plugs make a big impact on the user ratings charts, while there seem to be more and more 'what's the best...' threads - exactly the sort of question that a a responsive chart should answer.

If I could quote myself from another thread,
Topiness wrote:
Maybe the rating thing does need looking at. at the moment, it seems like a synth can get a load of good reviews one year, then stay at the top of the charts forever. At the same time, the '5 or more reviews' requirement combined with the fact that people don't seem to do reviews mean that some plugs with great reputations (artsacoustic reverb?) don't appear in the charts.

Maybe

- reviews over a couple of years old could be weighted down

- something could be done to encourage more reviews. Maybe a raffle each month, where for each review you get put in a draw to win a plug? People will spend forever discussing plugs in the forums, but this info never gets into the reviews. e.g. With all the hot air over NI Massive - not a single review.

at any rate, with the low number of reviews now being made, the minimum 5 reviews seems harsh. Maybe 2 or 3? With most people going straight for the 10 rating anyway, the advantage of averaging out multiple reviews seems lower...

Any chance of a change in the system? and if so, any better suggestions?

Topiness
KVRist
379 posts since 21 Nov, 2005

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 2:54 am

Another interesting ratings model: http://www.tiobe.com/tpci.htm. Not quite sure how it would be translated to plug-ins though!
Last edited by Topiness on Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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MachFront
KVRian
575 posts since 11 Jul, 2006 from Fayetteville, GA

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 4:42 pm

I agree absolutely.

For instance everyone seems to love Oatmeal...but no reviews, thus no good rating...therefore anyone who could simply take a look at the user ratings could see that it had been rated well and was worth looking into.
I mean, what's the point of looking at the user ratings section if a lot of what you see are the best synths, etc. from years ago??? A little weird.
(this is obvious, I'm just saying it.)

Also, this may very well cut down on "what's the best" threads, clearing up space.

I think an option to write a review is the way to go. Along with a separate point rating system. In other words, a KVR member could simply rate the software on the point system and not write a review if they wished. Much like Amazon.
I s'pose you'd have to make it so that once a user has voted that they couldn't vote again.

I've been wondering the whole time I've been aware of KVR why the ratings/reviews hadn't been handled in this way, or some better way as it has been.
This is the best place of it's kind, and if the rating system is improved it will be an invaluable resource on an already informative site.

Please, please fix/update/improve/change the rating system. It would be a great help to many.
"The last man on earth doesn't miss anyone at all." - Haujobb, Faith In Chaos

Topiness
KVRist
379 posts since 21 Nov, 2005

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:37 pm

With Oatmeal, i think the issue is that it's still supposedly in beta, although i think the developer has questioned this himself in forums.

It's another possible distorting factor, because many developers of free software are much more modest with their beta status / version numbers (there's no real advantage in making a big thing of a version number if you're not looking to make money).

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MachFront
KVRian
575 posts since 11 Jul, 2006 from Fayetteville, GA

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:48 pm

This is true. And, yes, I thought I remembered the dev mentioning that as well...though I can't recall what exactly he said and where.

As far as the beta thing. I don't think it would be so bad so long as there was a disclaimer noting that the version is beta and that the rating may reflect that fact.
But...then again, on that they'd have to allow folks to vote more than once. Hm.
Guess the easiest thing is indeed to still disallow rating of beta's. Bit of a pity.

I certainly hope the rating system is addressed no matter the decision.
"The last man on earth doesn't miss anyone at all." - Haujobb, Faith In Chaos

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1-2-Many
KVRAF
2852 posts since 23 Feb, 2004 from Planet Earth...for now

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:53 pm

I've often thought it would be cool to be able to just 'vote' for a plug on its KVR page, rather than having to write a lengthy review. Each member could vote for as many of their favorites as they wish (only once of course). Then plugs could simply be ranked by # of votes.

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1-2-Many
KVRAF
2852 posts since 23 Feb, 2004 from Planet Earth...for now

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 5:56 pm

Ranking could also still be seperated into Free and Commercial categories as well.

Topiness
KVRist
379 posts since 21 Nov, 2005

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:09 pm

MachFront wrote:As far as the beta thing. I don't think it would be so bad so long as there was a disclaimer noting that the version is beta and that the rating may reflect that fact.
But...then again, on that they'd have to allow folks to vote more than once.
It's a tricky one... but couldn't people just be allowed to amend their view / ranking at any time, rather than voting again? And if they didn't do so, do you think a 'fading weighting' (i.e. a ranking being given less importance as it gets older) would help fairness?
1-2-Many wrote: I've often thought it would be cool to be able to just 'vote' for a plug on its KVR page, rather than having to write a lengthy review
That sounds good. Or maybe give it a quick mark out of 10? one or more of the categories usually turn out to be difficult to rate for most plugs anyway, as is often mentioned in the reviews.

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MachFront
KVRian
575 posts since 11 Jul, 2006 from Fayetteville, GA

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:24 pm

1-2-Many wrote:I've often thought it would be cool to be able to just 'vote' for a plug on its KVR page, rather than having to write a lengthy review. Each member could vote for as many of their favorites as they wish (only once of course). Then plugs could simply be ranked by # of votes.
Yes. Like I said.
Simply rate it or rate it and write a review...or heck, just write a review without voting...


@Topiness - Yes, you're right. It would probably be much better to allow members to amend their rating as long as the product was in beta, or was in beta at the time of their first votes.
"The last man on earth doesn't miss anyone at all." - Haujobb, Faith In Chaos

VitaminD
Pick Me Pick me!
8802 posts since 12 Mar, 2002 from a state of confusion

Post Fri Dec 29, 2006 6:31 pm

We need a robust user and plugin ratings system.. not only should the plugins get a rating but the members/users should too..

then link the ratings to where depending on how well a person's reviews are recieved, their personal user rating would be adjusted as a result..

of course other things should contribute to the user rating.. like helpfulness or a lack thereof.. etc

having some of the plugins on the front page would be welcomed by me too... I learned of quite a few nice ones as a result of having them listed on the front page.. maybe the website could randomly pick 5 or so and list the on some part of the page.
"Use the talents you possess, for the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except the best." - Henry Van Dyke

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MachFront
KVRian
575 posts since 11 Jul, 2006 from Fayetteville, GA

Post Sat Dec 30, 2006 2:35 pm

I don't know about the "member/user ratings" thing.
I mean, I understand that if a person is more knowledgeable or has written a better review then it may stand to reason that their treview/rating may have more merit, then again isn't that a little bit exclusionary?
Honestly if myself or person A thinks something is quality and sounds great or has a great VFM and/or is very stable then who care how helpful we've been or not been?

I dunno.

What I do know is that I think many more folks need to be chiming in on this subject. I KNOW there are more than four people on KVR that want the rating system changed/improved/updated.
"The last man on earth doesn't miss anyone at all." - Haujobb, Faith In Chaos

VitaminD
Pick Me Pick me!
8802 posts since 12 Mar, 2002 from a state of confusion

Post Sun Dec 31, 2006 11:55 am

because there could be coupons and discounts as well as free gifts for the top rated peoples every month!

if person X posts 10 messages and say 8 are nonsense or bad info then people should have notice that X gives unreliable information.. without having to live here to figure out who is who..
"Use the talents you possess, for the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except the best." - Henry Van Dyke

Mighty Pea
KVRian
932 posts since 21 Mar, 2006

Post Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:58 pm

I don't agree with giving more weight to the opinions of some, but i definately do agree with a system where you could flag posts that strike you as nonsense, and if there is consistent voting by a lot of people on the same user, then that persons opinion would be rated very lowly?
and it should be incognito, so there's no foul play :D
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The Chase
KVRAF
10539 posts since 13 Jun, 2004 from Alberto Balsam

Post Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:36 pm

I just think more people should review. I always forget I should review more.

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BONES
GRRRRRRR!
9073 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Post Wed Jan 24, 2007 12:15 am

1-2-Many wrote:I've often thought it would be cool to be able to just 'vote' for a plug on its KVR page, rather than having to write a lengthy review. Each member could vote for as many of their favorites as they wish (only once of course). Then plugs could simply be ranked by # of votes.
Yeah, I think a lot of people are put off by having to be identified with a written review. If you could just do the ratings part, enter your user name so that the system won't let you rate anything more than once and add it to the overall score, I think a lot more people would get involved.
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