kevvvvv's reply to recent forum mess

[BorrelNote]

feck...I forgot what I was going to post.

[Spe3D]

I have nothing of value to add to this debate

So I will just write this,

A mod can set the example and tone for a forum - from there everything filters down

[BONES]

uh bullshit. sorry but you guys have no place telling mods when they can and can't lock and delete threads. we don't need your permission, and if you don't like it, TOUGH

Spoken like a true 5 year-old. Nobody is trying to tell anyone what to do. I'm just providing feedback and hoping it will result in some changes, or at least greater clarification.

because the issue REALLY should have been past by now, and these threads are all over the place. If you "move on" you still see them everywhere. No one has been hurt and this isnt nearly the first time KvR has seen such an explosion, so why doesnt everyone pick up their marbles and get on with life?

Mostly because the issue has not been resolved at all. If anything, I have less confidence that KVR will return to the way it was a couple of weeks ago than I did before.

HOW MANY TIMES DOES THIS NEED TO BE QUOTED BEFORE MEMBERS CAN ACCEPT THE FEW SIMPLE RULES TO RUNNING THE FORUM SMOOTHLY??

Would this be somethign similar to accepting the rules that black people cannot use the same public toilets as white people and that they have to sit at the back of the bus? Yes, it's an extreme and possibly inflammatory example but sometimes rules need to change.

[Muff Wiggler]

hey where were you guys when every single thread started by djdorian (or about djdorian) got removed?

where were you when all the threads by XG2 got removed?

why are you hopping on this bandwagon when it suits your own personal motives, but turning a blind eye when you are happy to see the content removed?

thread removal is nothing new. neither is hopping on bandwagons. we all wish they wouldn't have to happen, but it seems to be the nature of forums.

it's not always about YOU, it's about what's best for the COMMUNITY.

please remember that for each of the roughly eighteen of you who like to stir the pot and politicize and criticize everything and everyone who doesn't agree with you, that there are TENS OF THOUSANDS of reasonable members who CAN respect the rules of membership here, are OK with accepting how KVR works in exchange for a great forum, and DO NOT want to see this krap whenever they come here for some music information.

I don't think i've got anything else to say in this thread.

[pHz]

Spoken like a true 5 year-old. Nobody is trying to tell anyone what to do. I'm just providing feedback and hoping it will result in some changes, or at least greater clarification.

not sure his comment (although plural) was aimed at you warren - i rather think it was at eduardo who WAS trying to tell us how to mod the forum)

Mostly because the issue has not been resolved at all. If anything, I have less confidence that KVR will return to the way it was a couple of weeks ago than I did before.

although to some extent i agree with some of the points you raised originally this is bullshit - KVR is no different fundamentally now than it was two weeks ago or three years ago - threads have always been moved deleted and locked according to a given mods mood and interpretation of the rules - the fact that a few people have got pissy over the nexus threads and you (and others) feel personally affronted by kevvvvvs actions (to which i remain totally indifferent) doesnt actually change the place as a whole

Would this be something similar to accepting the rules that black people cannot use the same public toilets as white people and that they have to sit at the back of the bus? Yes, it's an extreme and possibly inflammatory example but sometimes rules need to change.

my perception here is that like others you seem to again be confusing the 'global' and the personal - its fine to have objections to kevvvvvs (or any mods) actions but to then extrapolate that out to the way KVR is run and the rules ben put in place is to miss the point somewhat

slainte rob

(edited to correct grammar

[ATS]

"Elite-ness/Egos/One-upmanship/Penis comparison "

Remember this one please Muff .

[beergeek]

All of this reminds me of my own experience. I owned a board on a major service a long time ago. I started it with one simple rule - treat everyone with the respect that you feel you deserve.

I had major manufacturers not only posting but having what amounted to at the time, live chats.

It was a boatload of work for me and my mods and the only thing I got out of it (no advertising) was the cost of my own membership to the service, the mods membership and the cost of the board. Yes, I had to pay to have it but if you had x amount of posts, it was free along with a small number of memberships.

So we had some huge Flame War instigated by one member who started cussing one manufacturer (for charging for an upgrade, ironic no?) and flamed anyone who came to their defense. He rallied a bunch of others with him. As all flame wars go, it became bigger than the issue. Never takes long for it to get personal, does it?

So I banned him for 30 days and removed the offensive posts, which btw, included some racial slurs. I got a ton of heat for it. I let him back in after the 30 days and he started all over again and kept it up after repeated warnings.

So I banned him for 90 days and deleted entire threads. You would have thought I had killed a puppy the way some of those people reacted.

I had people calling my house at all hours, emailing me nasty-grams and I even got public threats of physical violence. One guy said he was going to come to my house, rip my head off and piss down my neck. That was the last straw.

Well, I locked the whole thing, wrote one last post as a reply to that one:

"Be careful Jim, I piss back. I don't need this. This board is closed."

I guess what I'm saying is no matter what you think about how this is run, Ben and his mods have every right to do what they want, we are all Ben's guests.

So beat the freakin' horse all you want. Beat it too much and there may not be a horse.

BTW, I have a flame-proof suit so flame on.

[Muff Wiggler]

"Elite-ness/Egos/One-upmanship/Penis comparison "

Remember this one please Muff .

It was Chase who showed his penis. Not only would it have been breaking the rules, it also wouldn't have been fair to poor Chase had I pulled out my own.

edit: oops, looks like i inadvertantly broke the rules with this post anyway. would you guys freak out if i used that as a reason to finally lock this sad thread? or would you call me inconsistent if i didn't?

[visa tapani]

it's getting REALLY tired mate and it's not making you look very good. it's not your job to tell us how to do OUR jobs or to interpret the rules, thats what the MODS and BEN do, NOT YOU.

+ 1

[The Chase]

"Elite-ness/Egos/One-upmanship/Penis comparison "

Remember this one please Muff .

It was Chase who showed his penis. Not only would it have been breaking the rules, it also wouldn't have been fair to poor Chase had I pulled out my own.

edit: oops, looks like i inadvertantly broke the rules with this post anyway. would you guys freak out if i used that as a reason to finally lock this sad thread? or would you call me inconsistent if i didn't?

I never showed my penis to KvR

[Horse]

So beat the freakin' horse all you want. Beat it too much and there may not be a horse.

Oi! Leave me out of this.

Honestly - you lot. Haven't you got better things to do? This is the worse case of winding everyone up that I've seen in a long while. Trolling... is that what you call it?

Please just shut up and go and make some music or something, otherwise I'm going to have to come over there and bang some heads together.

Oh yeah, and leave the mods alone or else.

Happy Christmas.

H

[manytone]

uh bullshit. sorry but you guys have no place telling mods when they can and can't lock and delete threads. we don't need your permission, and if you don't like it, TOUGH

Spoken like a true 5 year-old. Nobody is trying to tell anyone what to do. I'm just providing feedback and hoping it will result in some changes, or at least greater clarification.

Warren, You know we like you and respect you as a Forum member and appreciate all you do here, I have even told you that personally before, and I still feel that way, but that comment is really uncalled for. You have to understand that Muff Wiggler has been attacked and taken a lot of unneccasary shots geared at all the mods, from a few folks lately and not only in this thread. He has stood up for what KVR is about and I think he is a Top Mod and Ben made a great choice when he appointed him Mod. I can only imagine how frustrated he is right now.

It is not about hiding information... It is about maintaining a Signal to Noise ratio that is acceptable.

This ain't about you, but perhaps about others who are going beyond your original points. The same guys who are continually stirring the pot in a bad way. That is where Muff or any of the other Mods draw the line and say enough.

KVR never changes ...so don't worry too much about that.

I just feel bad that Muff is taking a bunch of shots lately as I think he, as well as all the other Mods here are doing a standup job overall.

[opia]

Spoken like a true 5 year-old. Nobody is trying to tell anyone what to do. I'm just providing feedback and hoping it will result in some changes, or at least greater clarification.

occasionally things will get out of hand and mods may do something you disagree with
have fun in your (seemingly neverending) quest to change things so this never happens again

[whyterabbyt]

Moderators need the respect of those who participate on KVR. They can earn it or they can lose it. It's not up to us to give it to them if they don't earn it.

There probably isnt a moderator here who doesnt have more respect than you do. For one thing, I dont see any of them trying to speak for the entirety of KVR e.g.

Certainly one of the reasons this issue of deletion is still being discussed is because for those who participate here, the disappearance of threads destroys the very purpose of KVR boards and simply makes the process arbitrary

Utter bullshit.

Its amazing, though. Ive seen you push your pro-warez agenda into every thread you can find. And surprise, surprise, you've managed to find yet another thread to bring it up in, under the masquerade of trying to tell other people how they should do their job, despite the fact that the guy who actually gets to tell them has already done so. That'd be the same guy who set up the rules on warez that you have such a big issue with by the way. You really do think a lot yourself, dont you?

You want a forum where moderators need to consent in threes to delete something, and every possible warez thread is welcome? f**k off then, start your own forum, and get the hell out of ours.

Because quite frankly, this place doesnt get worse because threads get deleted; it gets worse because of two kinds of people... the trolling assholes, and the people like you and BONES who insist that the only opinion that should be tolerated on a subject is that which agrees with your own.

[Muff Wiggler]

Thank-you Paul

don't worry about the shots - i know well it comes with the job and don't really care THAT much what people think to be honest....

...but i think BONES missed what pHz and probably most everyone else got, is that my comment wasn't directed towards him at all, but at the people who WERE trying to tell mods how to do their job. i guess BONES is taking this all very personally (fair enough, and i can understand that having a strong connection to this place myself), and indeed i could have added a quote at the start of my post to clarify exactly *who* it was directed at, but i didn't

anyway thanks though lots of people here are really supportive.... honestly soon enough this will all drop and it'll be business as usual 'till the next flare-up. i hope this one drops off soon, and the next one holds itself off for a while.... maybe.... with some luck....