KVR Audio

jens · Post by **jens** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 1:28 pm

Sascha Franck wrote:
fandango wrote:I'm kinda curious to know what 'rights' some people think they have on KVR? No one (afaik) pays any money into Ben's server costs, or pays for the priveledge of posting here. The only people who do that are advertisers (including, shock-horror!, ReFX! oh-noes!!!).
Yet, the actual content is made up by the users.
Just getting to know which new plugins have been released isn't a biggie anymore, even with KVR still being the No.1 source.

So, when I'm looking for a certain plugin, some tips, some sampler, a sequencer - my first step usually isn't looking into the news, instruments or whatever sections, no, it's looking up the forum for comments and reading some reviews. Both are invaluable as they are made *for* users *by* users.

Without the user input, to me KVR would be just another news site.

So, in the end, the financial aspect of KVR might be covered by its sponsors, but the actual content of the site is "sponsored" by its users.

indeed - without us regulars KVR wasn't worth a dime.

zircon · Post by **zircon** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:28 pm

So? That doesn't give you any additional rights whatsoever, believe it or not, past what you agreed to in the terms of service.

jens · Post by **jens** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:35 pm

zircon wrote:So? That doesn't give you any additional rights whatsoever, believe it or not, past what you agreed to in the terms of service.

Could you please quote where I said it would give me 'any additional rights whatsoever'?

If not then please be so kind as to shut the f**k up instead!

AgonisThorn · Post by **AgonisThorn** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 7:53 pm

I will be SO glad when Christmas is past and the children are over their sugar-rush...the noise is deafening.

Sascha Franck · Post by **Sascha Franck** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:00 pm

It's not about rights. It's just about that large portions of KVRs content are created by us members (and no Jens, I'm not talking about regulars only).
Yes, there's a whole bunch of brainless farting created by us as well, so everybody should try to keep things in balance.

_niko_ · Post by **_niko_** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:14 pm

Well, I didn't comment on the whole soap till now, but what the hell:

AgonisThorn wrote:I will be SO glad when Christmas is past and the children are over their sugar-rush...the noise is deafening.

So what? As if anyone would give a f**k if you'd stay away till next year

Bones point is valid, IMHO, and the only means of us simple members to oppose is to make some noise. Thread deletion and moving should, if really necessary, at least be announced and commented, otherwise it's just plain censorship, which I wholeheartedly loathe.
Every company in the world, no matter what business, has to live with users voicing their opinions, and sometimes even bad mouthing them. Justified or not, that's just what free speech is all about.
On the other hand, ironically, the whole drama has propably brought more attention to that synth, than it deserves and it would have gotten otherwise...

1-2-Many · Post by **1-2-Many** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 8:20 pm

Sascha Franck wrote:Yet, the actual content is made up by the users.
Just getting to know which new plugins have been released isn't a biggie anymore, even with KVR still being the No.1 source.

So, when I'm looking for a certain plugin, some tips, some sampler, a sequencer - my first step usually isn't looking into the news, instruments or whatever sections, no, it's looking up the forum for comments and reading some reviews. Both are invaluable as they are made *for* users *by* users.

Without the user input, to me KVR would be just another news site.

So, in the end, the financial aspect of KVR might be covered by its sponsors, but the actual content of the site is "sponsored" by its users.

Regarding the very Nexus issue, I still wish kevvvvv would speak up, but I'm more or less over it myself though.
That however doesn't mean BONES doesn't make some fairly valid points. He defenitely does.

What he said.

pHz · Post by **pHz** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 10:33 pm

this isnt necessarily about the process - theres a whole load of personality shit mixed in there too i guess

(in no way taking a stance either way on kevvvvvs alleged actions - dont know why it happened - dont really give a shit either)

kevvvvvs alleged historical defence of / alluded connection to reFX should also be discounted - i have pretty strong links with at least 2 high profile devs / companies here yet noone has yet called me out on being biased because of it yet undoubtedly at times it HAS affected decisions i make i guess

i know its slightly different since it wasnt in the 'main' forums but when i TOTALLY arbitrarily locked HPC down and deleted everything on a whim no-one raised an eyebrow and even treated it like a joke despite me doing for completely serious reasons

i also play around occasionally with folks posts just for the hell of it (admittedly in OT but that shouldnt make it any less a dodgy thing to do on the level BONES is talking about)

wheres my witch hunt ?

(the 'social' thing arke talked about elsewhere is a total red herring IMHO)

this is between kevvvvv and ben now as far as im concerned - warren if you dont like the way the forum section of this place is run / modded then theres an easy answer

slainte

rob

Freeform · Post by **Freeform** » Tue Dec 12, 2006 11:39 pm

In my opinion, Kvr is what we make of it as users, as with anything. I try not to have "expecations" of forums in general personally, but I also understand the reason that people get upset when a thread is deleted, and they are enjoying a good conversation. A beautiful central example of this is the horrid digital bass thread. At page 108, Ben wrote "It's time for this topic to be put to bed", and locked it.

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... start=1605

Do I care? Was there a massive Digital Bass Rebellion? Nope. Reason being that it was 108 pages, and some people found it annoying. If you take this parallel and apply it to the reFX topic, I believe it's perfectly justified comparatively.

BONES · Post by **BONES** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:13 am

fandango wrote:I'm kinda curious to know what 'rights' some people think they have on KVR? No one (afaik) pays any money into Ben's server costs, or pays for the priveledge of posting here. The only people who do that are advertisers (including, shock-horror!, ReFX! oh-noes!!!).

What the hell are you talking about? Nobody has suggested that we have any rights, I've just been exercising what I do have to complain about behaviour that I think is hurting KVR's reputation. I'm not demanding anything be done, just letting whoever know that I'm unhappy about the situation. I'm sur ethat if you were capable of forming an opinion on anything, you might like to feel free to express it soemwhere on these forums. I look forward to that day.

zircon wrote:So? That doesn't give you any additional rights whatsoever, believe it or not, past what you agreed to in the terms of service.

We don't need any, we have all the rights we can handle already. If anything, I think someone might need their mod rights removed.

zircon · Post by **zircon** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 2:17 am

Haha; alright. Just seemed like the implication (by some other posters - not you) was in fact otherwise. I mod at another forum that is quite large, and all of this stuff is just as much of a headache there as it is here.

AgonisThorn · Post by **AgonisThorn** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 12:50 pm

_niko_ wrote:So what? As if anyone would give a f**k if you'd stay away till next year

Thanks, _niko_, and the "Happy Christmas" extends to you as well.

The point of my post was that I'd read the last three pages of this thread and found no new information. I (much to my dismay) only get around to KVR once or twice a week, and managed to miss all the threads that are the subject of this brouhaha; thus, I am in no position to offer an opinion regarding the rightness or wrongness of locking/deleting/whatevering them.

I DO, however, feel that posts in such a discussion should contain useful information; therefore, I apologise for my blithe dismissal, and am now off to make music. Better use of my time, I believe. Ta, all.

jens · Post by **jens** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:23 pm

Sascha Franck wrote:and no Jens, I'm not talking about regulars only

with that I meant members who are rather posting than lurking - without them there'd be obviously nothing to lurk at.

grillo · Post by **grillo** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 5:07 pm

I think bones has got a point after all, and i don't agree with whoever said he should drop the whole issue because he's it clear enough and we all know about this whole 'situation', matter of fact i was away for a full week with only spare access to the internet and looks like i missed the whole episode.

laputa_sync · Post by **laputa_sync** » Wed Dec 13, 2006 5:31 pm

jackson wrote:I'm going to have to stop off at the store on the way home to grab some popcorn.

KVR Audio

NOT Good Enough