AMD's a-comin!!!... and Intel's been a-dunnin!!

[AdvancedFollower]

Upcoming threadripper means that finally there's power to run shit almost with impunity. it will be mine! hehehehehe

https://wccftech.com/amds-ryzen-threadr ... -retailer/

Unfortunatelly Ableton (and probably all DAWs for that matter) is limited by single-core performance. A single master bus with Ozone 8 plugins is more tasking for CPU than 30 parallel instrument tracks.

However, I'm looking forward to new Ryzen next year, hopefully with significantly higher clocks.

Nu uh "FL Studio can use as many cores as your CPU has."

I don't deny it can, but it is limited by longest chain performance. You can't process heavy chain of subsequent plugins on multiple cores.

Yes, this is true for pretty much all modern DAWs. It's the simple nature of running multiple threads in parallel. You can't solve X+4 until you've figured out what X is in the first place, because the end result is going to depend on it. Same with audio, if you have a compressor after an EQ, the compressor needs to "know" what the EQ'd signal sounds like, so it has to wait until that has been calculated, which takes a certain number of CPU cycles. Maybe there's something else that core could work on in the meanwhile, but then again, bouncing threads between cores also impacts performance negatively.

However having many cores is still extremely useful for audio production, since you spend a lot of time mixing together many different channels/signal chains which can be independently calculated in parallel by different cores/threads. I'm certainly finding my Ryzen 1800X faster than my old 4770K. Maybe it's possible I could bring a single core to its knees by piling on effects in series, but for everything I do normally, it's great. I can just keep adding channels and layering stuff without worrying about the CPU. Then again, this is a single-die CPU, and I'm running fast 3200 MHz CAS14 memory (this makes a huge difference to the latency on Ryzen/TR). I don't think a multi-chip module would be ideal for DAWs.

[Kaine]

Maybe there's something else that core could work on in the meanwhile, but then again, bouncing threads between cores also impacts performance negatively.

Aye, it's why we have SMT/HT. Sure, the performance has a negative overhead, this is why we don't see double the performance when multi-threading. Still 30% or 40% extra is still better than just letting it go to waste.

[Kaine]

Took me a while this one as I've revisited it a few times this week, with a different slant on the testing but ultimately we're seeing the same architecture choices as Gen 1 and the same sort of outcome for low latency work.

http://www.scanproaudio.info/2018/08/24 ... repeating/

[Debutante]

So if you can live with latency, the reduced overhead is... not so bad???

[Ben H]

Took me a while this one as I've revisited it a few times this week, with a different slant on the testing but ultimately we're seeing the same architecture choices as Gen 1 and the same sort of outcome for low latency work.

http://www.scanproaudio.info/2018/08/24 ... repeating/

So more than 2 years on since the OP started this thread, and AMD is STILL a-comin!!!

[Kaine]

So if you can live with latency, the reduced overhead is... not so bad???

Only if your mastering I guess might it make any sense, but when you're using virtual instraments then you can only use half of the CPU and you're never quite sure when it's going to tip over mid-project.

On that basis, it's far worse value than the 7980XE or even the 7960X for just audio use and the same price as the more expensive option. As was pointed out to me over the weekend, I really need to bench the 7980XE again with current benchmarks.

[Debutante]

Okay... so what happens when you have say 2 FL Studios open, and ReWire into itself. Not using FL as a plugin, but using the ReWire function?? I'm trying it right now.... and apparently FL rewires into itself lovelyly... which SHOULD really be a word, shouldn't it?? As smooth as 'cellar door'.

[Scotty]

I hope the upshot of this is more downward pressure on Intel for pricing. The Theradripper 2 seems to be a beast for video editing/rendering on multithreaded aware applications. Hopefully Intel will feel the heat and we audio nerds can see a few hundred dollar price reduction on the the 7980XE. I want to do my new build in February or March and by then hopefully 32 gigs of RAM will be within reach, motherboards will have settled into below $500 territory and this build will be doable.

[egbert]

Intel has been starving the consumer market of any increase in cores and instead using >50% of the die for an on-die graphics unit which underperforms what a cheap dedicated card delivers. It is coming up for ten years of quadcores at the high end of their consumer range.

Meanwhile, they take the same cores and put up to 22 of them in a Xeon and sell them to server/workstation market for up to $4k. The arrival of AMD in this space is raining on that little parade and we should be reaping the benefits in terms of price and performance for the forseeable future.

[Kaine]

Okay... so what happens when you have say 2 FL Studios open, and ReWire into itself. Not using FL as a plugin, but using the ReWire function?? I'm trying it right now.... and apparently FL rewires into itself lovelyly... which SHOULD really be a word, shouldn't it?? As smooth as 'cellar door'.

Which client is managing the load balancing if you do?

We're in a siutation where programmers can't force a perticular set of cores to be used, although if you could hard assign them, it would solve the issue I reckon or at least provide some kind of workaround. The problem is, is that whatever the software attempts to do, Windows is just going to stomp all over it anyway.

I hope the upshot of this is more downward pressure on Intel for pricing. The Theradripper 2 seems to be a beast for video editing/rendering on multithreaded aware applications. Hopefully Intel will feel the heat and we audio nerds can see a few hundred dollar price reduction on the the 7980XE.

I guess it'll depend on how it sells through over the next few months. The 2950X has landed here at the 7980XE price point, so it's going to be interesting to see who flinches first and price drops.

Intel has been starving the consumer market of any increase in cores and instead using >50% of the die for an on-die graphics unit which underperforms what a cheap dedicated card delivers. It is coming up for ten years of quadcores at the high end of their consumer range.

Yeah, I guess. So. The IGP is only in the midrange admittedly, and our own market is one of the few places where it makes any real degree of sense. Outside of audio boxes, I think I'd prefer it to be limited to the i3's and below personally. On the plus side for those Intel IGP's is that the driver is the smoothest out there right now between the 3 of them.

Meanwhile, they take the same cores and put up to 22 of them in a Xeon and sell them to server/workstation market for up to $4k. The arrival of AMD in this space is raining on that little parade and we should be reaping the benefits in terms of price and performance for the forseeable future.

Yeah, agreed on that.

[Pictus]

I guess it'll depend on how it sells through over the next few months. The 2950X has landed here at the 7980XE price point, so it's going to be interesting to see who flinches first and price drops.

The 2950X?
Would not be the 2990WX?

[fluffy_little_something]

Even within the audio niche, 95% of users won't notice the difference between top AMD and Intel processors.

[Grizzellda]

Even within the audio niche, 95% of users won't notice the difference between top AMD and Intel processors.

You have mentioned that you got a new Ryzen system, right?

Are you satisfied with it?

[fluffy_little_something]

Even within the audio niche, 95% of users won't notice the difference between top AMD and Intel processors.

You have mentioned that you got a new Ryzen system, right?

Are you satisfied with it?

Well, I have very modest needs, I don't use hundreds of instances at the same time as they do in certain benchmarks. And I bet neither do the majority of computer music makers.
I deliberately bought only a 4-core, the 1500X. It works fine and very efficiently with Reaper.

[Grizzellda]

I deliberately bought only a 4-core, the 1500X. It works fine and very efficiently with Reaper.

Nice to hear. I think I will need a new machine at some point...

Well, it is OS concerns to consider. W 10, basically.