Vaz feature requests
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- KVRAF
- 12235 posts since 18 Aug, 2003
The basic freeverb algorithm is 8 parallel comb filters tuned just so, going into 4 allpass filters in series, also tuned just so. I've seen other implementations that go through the allpass series first then the comb filters. It's a pretty simple layout to set up and experiment with.
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- KVRian
- 513 posts since 9 Nov, 2000
Hi V-GER,
Minimum frequency varies from module to module and isn't that low on the Oscillator, no lower than sub-bass / high LFO range. As you've noticed this was addressed on more recent modules.
Martin
Minimum frequency varies from module to module and isn't that low on the Oscillator, no lower than sub-bass / high LFO range. As you've noticed this was addressed on more recent modules.
Martin
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- KVRian
- 1058 posts since 3 Oct, 2011
I hope some of this can be considered:
A "poly" button on the Random S modules where the polyphonic mode would include a separate rate for each voice/voicemodulation if it's modulated by for instance Voice Number or another Random S in "poly" mode.
2D envelopes would be great for making more of the vector mixer. There seem to be various kinds of those, perhaps someone more experienced could write a bit about pros and cons of the various approaches? Or are those place-up-to-4-or-8-or-16-points-within-a-square-or-circle-within-a-square-things called 2D envelopes?
Hard limiters that won't distort to anything, if possible, would be great tools. Attack and release times as short as possible at their shortest. Generally useful - and I sometimes wish I could squash a sound or a parallell processed version of a sound pretty much completely and reshape it with a modulated amp.
I'd appreciate longer delay times on the Tempo Delays, 50 seconds would be great and cover most things I can imagine right now
but I somehow suppose an expansion up to 20 or 10 seconds is more likely if you decide to expand it a bit. Perhaps a button somewhere for extra wide range delays, or a new similar module with longer delaytimes? Whatever works best considering loading old patches etc. Could a choice of reverse delays and reverse feedback become an option?
X-crossing or a trigger/gate at x module could be nice, like the zerocrossing with rise or fall or both just with a choice of a value of x instead of zero only. Thus a trigger signal could be had at a certain stage in an envelope or some other modulation source with distinct rise and fall stages.
I hope this makes sense to others: A modulatable rate generator and a modulatable slew limiter grouped together in one module, where the slew limiters maximum limiting would always correspond to the time of one rate/step on the rate generator. And a trigger input for the rate generator. One possibility is to use more than one for several s&h signals from the same source with different rates and slews that can all be modulated without the slew limiting exceeding the length of the current rate.
Better multicore support on the stand-alone version for utilising more of the computers power would make a big difference for the better (naturally), though I've the impression that multicore isn't always easy to deal with for devs. Or are there any options somewhere that I've overlooked?
When a module has been clicked on in the "Edit" menu it would be very helpful if the visual contrast could be greater when the module "lights up", every now and then I loose track of some module (roughly every 14 days in periods when I tweak Vaz M every day)...
Would a Pitch/frequencytracking module be hard to make?
And finally (for now...): Could the + and - key activation of transposition be user-deactivated or shortcuts altered by the user so I won't keep accidentelly transposing Vaz Modular all over the place?
Thank you in advance should any of these suggestions find their way into a future version of Vaz Modular.
A "poly" button on the Random S modules where the polyphonic mode would include a separate rate for each voice/voicemodulation if it's modulated by for instance Voice Number or another Random S in "poly" mode.
2D envelopes would be great for making more of the vector mixer. There seem to be various kinds of those, perhaps someone more experienced could write a bit about pros and cons of the various approaches? Or are those place-up-to-4-or-8-or-16-points-within-a-square-or-circle-within-a-square-things called 2D envelopes?
Hard limiters that won't distort to anything, if possible, would be great tools. Attack and release times as short as possible at their shortest. Generally useful - and I sometimes wish I could squash a sound or a parallell processed version of a sound pretty much completely and reshape it with a modulated amp.
I'd appreciate longer delay times on the Tempo Delays, 50 seconds would be great and cover most things I can imagine right now
but I somehow suppose an expansion up to 20 or 10 seconds is more likely if you decide to expand it a bit. Perhaps a button somewhere for extra wide range delays, or a new similar module with longer delaytimes? Whatever works best considering loading old patches etc. Could a choice of reverse delays and reverse feedback become an option? X-crossing or a trigger/gate at x module could be nice, like the zerocrossing with rise or fall or both just with a choice of a value of x instead of zero only. Thus a trigger signal could be had at a certain stage in an envelope or some other modulation source with distinct rise and fall stages.
I hope this makes sense to others: A modulatable rate generator and a modulatable slew limiter grouped together in one module, where the slew limiters maximum limiting would always correspond to the time of one rate/step on the rate generator. And a trigger input for the rate generator. One possibility is to use more than one for several s&h signals from the same source with different rates and slews that can all be modulated without the slew limiting exceeding the length of the current rate.
Better multicore support on the stand-alone version for utilising more of the computers power would make a big difference for the better (naturally), though I've the impression that multicore isn't always easy to deal with for devs. Or are there any options somewhere that I've overlooked?
When a module has been clicked on in the "Edit" menu it would be very helpful if the visual contrast could be greater when the module "lights up", every now and then I loose track of some module (roughly every 14 days in periods when I tweak Vaz M every day)...
Would a Pitch/frequencytracking module be hard to make?
And finally (for now...): Could the + and - key activation of transposition be user-deactivated or shortcuts altered by the user so I won't keep accidentelly transposing Vaz Modular all over the place?
Thank you in advance should any of these suggestions find their way into a future version of Vaz Modular.
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- KVRian
- 513 posts since 9 Nov, 2000
Hi V-GER,
Things which are straightforward to answer:
Random S already work as you want...! Just use Rate modulation, and if you need multiple modulations also use a mixer of some sort.
An envelope with time-based stage lengths would generalize to multiple dimensions quite naturally.
For limiting use the Compressor with ratio set to a high value. To squash perceived dynamics you might want it to follow RMS level which isn't possible at present?
Long delays would use a problematic amount of memory when polyphony is high, this has also been requested for Glitch Tempo and a solution would be applicable to all delay-based modules. Maybe allow longer delays at low polyphony? What is reverse feedback?
For X Crossing place a comparator before Zero Crossing?
Linked slew/rate... so this would be like a ramp which is crossfading from old to new sampled value? Trigger moves the new value to old value, samples new value and resets the ramp. Then as the ramp rises it crossfades from old to new. I think Smooth and Stepped can be used to build something like this, it's not far off the random patch which is the basis of Random S.
Multicore... the current solution as using multiple plugin instances in a multicore host.
Not so good pitch tracking would be fairly feasible, doing it well is not so easy I believe.
Will look at the +/- shortcuts.
Martin
Things which are straightforward to answer:
Random S already work as you want...! Just use Rate modulation, and if you need multiple modulations also use a mixer of some sort.
An envelope with time-based stage lengths would generalize to multiple dimensions quite naturally.
For limiting use the Compressor with ratio set to a high value. To squash perceived dynamics you might want it to follow RMS level which isn't possible at present?
Long delays would use a problematic amount of memory when polyphony is high, this has also been requested for Glitch Tempo and a solution would be applicable to all delay-based modules. Maybe allow longer delays at low polyphony? What is reverse feedback?
For X Crossing place a comparator before Zero Crossing?
Linked slew/rate... so this would be like a ramp which is crossfading from old to new sampled value? Trigger moves the new value to old value, samples new value and resets the ramp. Then as the ramp rises it crossfades from old to new. I think Smooth and Stepped can be used to build something like this, it's not far off the random patch which is the basis of Random S.
Multicore... the current solution as using multiple plugin instances in a multicore host.
Not so good pitch tracking would be fairly feasible, doing it well is not so easy I believe.
Will look at the +/- shortcuts.
Martin
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- KVRian
- 1058 posts since 3 Oct, 2011
Hi Martin,
I'm familiar with setting the ratio for limiting but it tends to distort when pushed as far as I'd like to go (due to the gain compensation I guess, might work for me to use a gain module after the compressor instead).. I would find a dedicated limiter module designed not to distort highly useful, but I'll get by with using some appropriate plugin. Not all that familiar with RMS yet, will look into it (there are some gaping holes in my knowledge of dynamic processing..)...
I always assumed the delays would be monophonic as I thought of them as effects more or less in the same sense as when we load plugins. That opens up a lot of possibilities I didn't know was there.
Yes, longer delays with a restriction on their polyphony will work just fine as I intend too use them as conventional effects mainly last or far back in the chain of sound. Perhaps a message could pop up if someone tries to increase the polyphony, telling us to decrease the delaytime first. Whatever turns out somewhat tidy and will make sense to people new to the program. Even a new module that's purely monophonic or a monophonic mode button will work just fine, especially if it can mix together any polyphonic signals recieved and just make the rest of the signalflow from there on monophonic (if that makes sense).
I have to go by ear as I've only heard reverse delay effects and not seen proper diagrams or anything, but my impression is reverse delays have «forward» feedback while reverse feedback will alternately back and forth for every echo as it dies away with a special kind of rhythmic effect.
I find Vaz Modular doesn't work so well in hosts as I can't open it fullscreen, too much scrolling drives a man insane... Not sure if this is an issue with hosts or if you could make a an option for when a bigger «workingspace» would be wanted (though it's probably a host issue as Vaz Modular can host itself just fine).
Not so good pitch tracking will be just fine for me (as long as it's not downright horrible), my intended use is mainly for modulating filters when processing audio - and a bit for retro MS-20-ish kind of unstable stuff if it should be suited for that. You could perhaps make it for the next update and look into possibly adding some HQ mode later on (a choice of modes would probably be better if you should improve it later, so patches allready made will sound and act the same)?
Oh, another issue: Though I can live with the comb filters distoring all the way into silence when pushed too far it sure would be nice with an option for something in the feedback chain that might prevent it.. Some simple compressor or limiter algorithm that can be activated if wanted, or perhaps something else is needed if it's more a matter of an overload of certain frequencies. It does happen under certain rare conditions with the reverb too without the volume being extreme at all, it seems harmonically rich material can distort and overload the reverb into what sounds like total silence... If I remember correctly it was some saw waveform through filters which where modulated by some other saws that triggered this, I'll try to recreate this.
One more little thing: Do you think there's room for another control row in the sequencer of the CV Converter, for velocity?
I'm familiar with setting the ratio for limiting but it tends to distort when pushed as far as I'd like to go (due to the gain compensation I guess, might work for me to use a gain module after the compressor instead).. I would find a dedicated limiter module designed not to distort highly useful, but I'll get by with using some appropriate plugin. Not all that familiar with RMS yet, will look into it (there are some gaping holes in my knowledge of dynamic processing..)...
I always assumed the delays would be monophonic as I thought of them as effects more or less in the same sense as when we load plugins. That opens up a lot of possibilities I didn't know was there.
Yes, longer delays with a restriction on their polyphony will work just fine as I intend too use them as conventional effects mainly last or far back in the chain of sound. Perhaps a message could pop up if someone tries to increase the polyphony, telling us to decrease the delaytime first. Whatever turns out somewhat tidy and will make sense to people new to the program. Even a new module that's purely monophonic or a monophonic mode button will work just fine, especially if it can mix together any polyphonic signals recieved and just make the rest of the signalflow from there on monophonic (if that makes sense). I have to go by ear as I've only heard reverse delay effects and not seen proper diagrams or anything, but my impression is reverse delays have «forward» feedback while reverse feedback will alternately back and forth for every echo as it dies away with a special kind of rhythmic effect.
I find Vaz Modular doesn't work so well in hosts as I can't open it fullscreen, too much scrolling drives a man insane... Not sure if this is an issue with hosts or if you could make a an option for when a bigger «workingspace» would be wanted (though it's probably a host issue as Vaz Modular can host itself just fine).
Not so good pitch tracking will be just fine for me (as long as it's not downright horrible), my intended use is mainly for modulating filters when processing audio - and a bit for retro MS-20-ish kind of unstable stuff if it should be suited for that. You could perhaps make it for the next update and look into possibly adding some HQ mode later on (a choice of modes would probably be better if you should improve it later, so patches allready made will sound and act the same)?
Oh, another issue: Though I can live with the comb filters distoring all the way into silence when pushed too far it sure would be nice with an option for something in the feedback chain that might prevent it.. Some simple compressor or limiter algorithm that can be activated if wanted, or perhaps something else is needed if it's more a matter of an overload of certain frequencies. It does happen under certain rare conditions with the reverb too without the volume being extreme at all, it seems harmonically rich material can distort and overload the reverb into what sounds like total silence... If I remember correctly it was some saw waveform through filters which where modulated by some other saws that triggered this, I'll try to recreate this.
One more little thing: Do you think there's room for another control row in the sequencer of the CV Converter, for velocity?
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- KVRian
- 1058 posts since 3 Oct, 2011
That took care of it, yes. A nice little bunch of useful options there.MadGav wrote:Go to the Editor page of Settings and set the the embed mode to Never?
I made and e-mailed a patch where the combfilter occasionally distorts into what sounds like pure noise until the feedback is turned way down, just leave it playing and it should do that pretty fast.MadGav wrote:Btw example patches are always useful to give a concrete illustration of bad/unwanted behaviour!
I'm trying to recreate the issue of the reverb distorting into silence, but now I can't. Some ultrarare issue with certain frequiencies clashing, I guess..
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- KVRist
- 47 posts since 17 Apr, 2006
Hi Martin,
I am currently experimenting with eurorack modular modules and really need the FX plugin version of VAZ to have more inputs and outputs.
I am trying to use external VCF's poly-phonically via a MOTU 24 IO and need to be able to do this via the plugin version, feeding the outputs of the VCF's back into VAZ.
Please could you release an update that has 8 ins 8 outs, 16 ins 16 outs and 32 ins 32 outs?
btw, will VAZ Modular 4 be multi-threaded?
Kevin
I am currently experimenting with eurorack modular modules and really need the FX plugin version of VAZ to have more inputs and outputs.
I am trying to use external VCF's poly-phonically
via a MOTU 24 IO and need to be able to do this via the plugin version, feeding the outputs of the VCF's back into VAZ.Please could you release an update that has 8 ins 8 outs, 16 ins 16 outs and 32 ins 32 outs?
btw, will VAZ Modular 4 be multi-threaded?
Kevin
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- KVRian
- 1058 posts since 3 Oct, 2011
Wouldn't it be possible to use the Sub Outputs in the 32-out VSTi and set them to "thru"? See the help section entry on "Sub Output". Or am I misunderstanding what you're trying to do here (perhaps you need 32 inputs and 32 throughputs for what youre intending to do)? Interesting experiment btw (though I personally will stick to software for the foreseable future).NFA wrote: I am currently experimenting with eurorack modular modules and really need the FX plugin version of VAZ to have more inputs and outputs.
I am trying to use external VCF's poly-phonically
Please could you release an update that has 8 ins 8 outs, 16 ins 16 outs and 32 ins 32 outs?
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- KVRist
- 47 posts since 17 Apr, 2006
The standalone version can do this supporting multiple ins/outs, but i use cantabile with upto 16 vaz modular plugins running with a single synth in each. This allows me to fully use 8 cores, cantabile load balances vst's perfectly.
Kevin
Kevin
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- KVRist
- 47 posts since 17 Apr, 2006
To spill the beans on the idea, I have a 8 voice poly synth patch, with 16 voice modules, splitting out each voices oscillator audio output and each voices envelope. I had this epiphany one day and realised I could break out the voices oscillators and control and then pass this out through lots of dc coupled audio outs, through 8 identical vcfs and then back into the same patch and through comb filters and amplifers and then through further processing in the digital domain, much like a Waldorf Q+ with none of bugs
I have found this even works for CV and Gate meaning that Vaz can control complete analogue voices polyphonically...
Vaz is fast becoming the centre of my Eurack modular system, the envelopes and slew rate limiters provide all cv control magic I could ever need.
I have found this even works for CV and Gate meaning that Vaz can control complete analogue voices polyphonically...
Vaz is fast becoming the centre of my Eurack modular system, the envelopes and slew rate limiters provide all cv control magic I could ever need.
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- KVRian
- 513 posts since 9 Nov, 2000
Hi NFA,
Just how much Eurocrack do you have???
Have 6u of Doepfer and an 828mk2 here hence the CV Out module for calibration to 1V/oct. I think an 8x8 effect would get a long way can you think of a realistic scenario which you couldn't cover with a couple of those?
Martin
Just how much Eurocrack do you have???
Have 6u of Doepfer and an 828mk2 here hence the CV Out module for calibration to 1V/oct. I think an 8x8 effect would get a long way can you think of a realistic scenario which you couldn't cover with a couple of those?Martin
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- KVRist
- 47 posts since 17 Apr, 2006
Hi Martin,
I have a handful of doepfer modules, maths, a couple of dixie vco's, ES3's, Havestman Zorlon cannon and polyvocks vcf. I also have a xoxboxIO, with full sync24 + CV control. Having performed some testing with a mono patch, I am in the process of choosing who to buy 8 identical vcf's from. I basically wanted to be sure VAZ could do this before spending a couple grand on vcf's. 8 in 8 out would be useful for effects, but for cv stuff like the 8 voice poly, I need 8 in 24 out. Basically, a oscillator mix out per voice, plus cv for freq and a cv for res and an audio in. So to keep it simple, if you made a 32 in 32 out that would cover all bases...
Kevin
I have a handful of doepfer modules, maths, a couple of dixie vco's, ES3's, Havestman Zorlon cannon and polyvocks vcf. I also have a xoxboxIO, with full sync24 + CV control. Having performed some testing with a mono patch, I am in the process of choosing who to buy 8 identical vcf's from. I basically wanted to be sure VAZ could do this before spending a couple grand on vcf's. 8 in 8 out would be useful for effects, but for cv stuff like the 8 voice poly, I need 8 in 24 out. Basically, a oscillator mix out per voice, plus cv for freq and a cv for res and an audio in. So to keep it simple, if you made a 32 in 32 out that would cover all bases...
Kevin
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- KVRian
- 513 posts since 9 Nov, 2000
If I was speculating wildly... it might be nice to have a "voice input" module which would route a group of hardware inputs to each voice of a patch and a corresponding "voice output" module. Would make polyphonic integration of a bank of analogue filters a snap
