Phase Plant released

[PieBerger]

I finally got around to checking out Phase Plant. I really like it so far, but is there any way to load multi-samples or is it just one sample per sample generator? I know I could load a bunch of Sample modules and have a different sample on each, but just wondered if there is another way using just one Sampler generator.

It's single sample only and AFAIK with no plans to make it multi-sample in the future. It's primarily an FM/PM/WT synth, with some basic (audio-rate mod capable) sampling added for a bit of funsies. They will be adding key and velocity groups at some point, and with up to 30 generators, it will be possible to create something akin to multisampled patches. EDIT: they're no doubt on a "if we make it multisample, people will expect big libaries" tip and wanted to avoid this.

[DocAtlas]

I finally got around to checking out Phase Plant. I really like it so far, but is there any way to load multi-samples or is it just one sample per sample generator? I know I could load a bunch of Sample modules and have a different sample on each, but just wondered if there is another way using just one Sampler generator.

It's single sample only and AFAIK with no plans to make it multi-sample in the future. It's primarily an FM/PM/WT synth, with some basic (audio-rate mod capable) sampling added for a bit of funsies. They will be adding key and velocity groups at some point, and with up to 30 generators, it will be possible to create something akin to multisampled patches. EDIT: they're no doubt on a "if we make it multisample, people will expect big libaries" tip and wanted to avoid this.

It can seem like a great idea to do FM (or other audio-rate modulation) with multi-samples, but complex waveforms, in general, often aren't the best choice. Whether single- or multi-sampled, the more partials the carrier and/or modulator have, the more potential for unusable sounds. Likewise with having more than a handful of operators in the same stack. This pdf: https://chrisarndt.de/files/yamaha/SY%2 ... 0v0.40.pdf discusses the topic. It also has some good tips for FM in general, even if you aren't using an SY99, SY77, or TG77.

[PieBerger]

It can seem like a great idea to do FM (or other audio-rate modulation) with multi-samples, but complex waveforms, in general, often aren't the best choice. Whether single- or multi-sampled, the more partials the carrier and/or modulator have, the more potential for unusable sounds.

kHs are aware of this, that's why here is a filter on the wavetable generator that allows you to sharply filter out the high frequencies. This way it's possible to use more complex waveforms from the wt generator, as both carrier and or modulator, while staying "musical" and not having to sacrifice a generator slot to do so. Very nice

[Demuvi]

Tested it today and deinstalled it 5 minutes later.

[starflakeprj]

Tested it today and deinstalled it 5 minutes later.

Care to explain why? Or otherwise your post was a complete waste of time, especially for us thinking of getting, or testing Phase Plant.

[metaside]

Tested it today and deinstalled it 5 minutes later.

I have to say, it was a bit similar for me. I love the concept, tried the demo in a bass-heavy DNB project and ended up with using exclusively other synths in the end. It's capable, but the factory presets are not very strong imho, there was not a single "yes, nice!" moment when switching through all the presets and even when modifying or making new presets I always switched to other synths for some reason after a short while. It just didn't click with me. In the end, I started using BW the Grid instead of PP.

[graspee]

I tested it today and found a lot of things missing that I would have expected at this price and considering how much some people rave about it: a massive lack of waveshaping capability, no choice of number of poles on the filters, big lack of effects in the expensive enough basic version of the synth etc.

edit: After some more hours testing it's the use for FM where this really shines. The left side filter sounds really good although I still wish you could choose the slope.

I went from not wanting it at all to thinking I'll pick it up in the first decent sale it gets. Just for FM use.

[Demuvi]

Care to explain why?

Of course i explain why! I thought it's completly on the hands why but OK.

First lets say that the synth has nothing special which isn't able to do with other synths.
It supports sample load but no multisample load... what?
ALL The FX sounds really CHEAP and basic and nothing special
The first BASS preset (i think it was called Anlalog FM) needs 50% CPU on a i9 9900X maschine?

The whole system is builded so confusing that when i see it from a noob-preset-rider view is not easy to understand. Experienced users will maybe understand this synth quick. But... ehm no... For me its absolutely not worth its price... and thats my last point.

The price of it is a bad joke! For Real!

[perpetual3]

Conceptually, PP seemed like a dream synth.

In the end, I just didn’t like the core sound and felt that the effects are sub standard.

[PieBerger]

Care to explain why?

Of course i explain why! I thought it's completly on the hands why but OK.

First lets say that the synth has nothing special which isn't able to do with other synths.
It supports sample load but no multisample load... what?
ALL The FX sounds really CHEAP and basic and nothing special
The first BASS preset (i think it was called Anlalog FM) needs 50% CPU on a i9 9900X maschine?

The whole system is builded so confusing that when i see it from a noob-preset-rider view is not easy to understand. Experienced users will maybe understand this synth quick. But... ehm no... For me its absolutely not worth its price... and thats my last point.

The price of it is a bad joke! For Real!

What are the other synths that combine PM, FM, Wavetable and Sampling (albeit rather basic), in a semi-modular/freely routable (mostly) environment, with modulatable FX and with good workflow ie no menu-diving/tabbing? I'd like to know about them the only synth that comes close in my opinion is Zebra, however it falls short in the audio-rate modulation department (until Z3 ) because you're restricted to the FM and XMF modules only; you can't modulate one wavetable osc with another or create feedback loops etc.

Regarding the noob-preset-rider view, I agree that it's probably quite confusing for people not familiar with synthesis, particular of the modular/semi kind, but I think it's a small price to pay to give those who do understand even the basics, a UI/UX that is very visual, flexible, powerful but only ever as complicated/hectic as you make it i.e. what you see is what you use. You can't make everyone happy and I'm glad they decided to prioritise more experienced users. This is very much a sound designers/serious enthusiasts kind of synth and more the better for it My other main synth is Hive 2 and one of the reasons I like it and use it so much, apart from it's great sound of course, is because the UI/UX is easy to understand and very immediate, however, it's a much simpler synth (not in a bad way) and having everything right at your fingertips is easier to implement without overcrowding the interface. Given what is possible in PP, I think kHs did a pretty stellar job with the UI/UX.

The price, especially for the complete bundle, is a little steep I would agree, but luckily the sub for the works bundle is really reasonable. If you read the first page, you will see I was originally a bit sceptical/miffed about the high purchase price pushing people towards their sub, but after learning a bit more the company and how they operate (they are very active on their Discord channel, doing AMAs, issuing regular updates and listening/responding to user feedback) and their introducing a loyalty scheme where for every 12 months (consecutive or not) you sub i.e. $120 you spend, you get $100 back as a voucher, I decided to jump on board. This is my one and likely only sub, unless other devs are prepared to offer such a deal, so for me personally it's a great deal.

[Demuvi]

What are the other synths that combine PM, FM, Wavetable and Sampling

Hmm... Parawave's Rapid ? VPS Avenger combined with Serum?

What I have from the best features when they bring my CPU to a boil?

I mean 50% for a bassline is really hard. I had also trouble with VPS Avenger with my old I7 975 Extreme. I decide to buy a new system with i9 9900X and avenger runs smooth now. Not having more than 20%. And now i tried Phase Plant with some presets killing even my i9 which would annoy me for a 349€ synth.

Now i wonder what would happend to my i7 when i tried the 50% bassline there ? burned

However... If there are people who like this synth, that's just fine. Tastes are different.
I just wrote about my personal opinion.
Regards.

[DJErmac]

Care to explain why?

Of course i explain why! I thought it's completly on the hands why but OK.

First lets say that the synth has nothing special which isn't able to do with other synths.
It supports sample load but no multisample load... what?
ALL The FX sounds really CHEAP and basic and nothing special
The first BASS preset (i think it was called Anlalog FM) needs 50% CPU on a i9 9900X maschine?

The whole system is builded so confusing that when i see it from a noob-preset-rider view is not easy to understand. Experienced users will maybe understand this synth quick. But... ehm no... For me its absolutely not worth its price... and thats my last point.

The price of it is a bad joke! For Real!

What are the other synths that combine PM, FM, Wavetable and Sampling (albeit rather basic), in a semi-modular/freely routable (mostly) environment, with modulatable FX and with good workflow ie no menu-diving/tabbing? I'd like to know about them

Who cares ? What if it had 2876 oscillators, 3456 LFO, 987465758 choices of analog filters, combine FM, wavetable, multisample with RR ? Would it automatically be the best synth ever ?
I agree, Phase Plant may combine PM, FM, Wavetable and anything you want, it fails to deliver any SOUND I've heard somewhere else, sorry.

[antic604]

The first BASS preset (i think it was called Anlalog FM) needs 50% CPU on a i9 9900X maschine?

It barely registers on the CPU meter of my (already) modest laptop. You're doing something wrong.

[PieBerger]

Care to explain why?

Of course i explain why! I thought it's completly on the hands why but OK.

First lets say that the synth has nothing special which isn't able to do with other synths.
It supports sample load but no multisample load... what?
ALL The FX sounds really CHEAP and basic and nothing special
The first BASS preset (i think it was called Anlalog FM) needs 50% CPU on a i9 9900X maschine?

The whole system is builded so confusing that when i see it from a noob-preset-rider view is not easy to understand. Experienced users will maybe understand this synth quick. But... ehm no... For me its absolutely not worth its price... and thats my last point.

The price of it is a bad joke! For Real!

What are the other synths that combine PM, FM, Wavetable and Sampling (albeit rather basic), in a semi-modular/freely routable (mostly) environment, with modulatable FX and with good workflow ie no menu-diving/tabbing? I'd like to know about them

Who cares ? What if it had 2876 oscillators, 3456 LFO, 987465758 choices of analog filters, combine FM, wavetable, multisample with RR ? Would it automatically be the best synth ever ?
I agree, Phase Plant may combine PM, FM, Wavetable and anything you want, it fails to deliver any SOUND I've heard somewhere else, sorry.

I think you misunderstand my point and my tone. It's not about having thousands of choices, in fact it's funny that you made such a comment, especially "987465758 choices of analog filters" because one of PP's weakest areas, by on-paper specs and feedback from users, is a lack of variety in the filter department It's also not about PP being the best synth in the world ever, because it's not and no other synth is either. You're just putting words into my mouth here...I was replying to "has nothing special which isn't able to do with other synths" , which I have taken to mean as lacking in features not anything along the lines of "in my personal opinion this synth fails to deliver soundwise compared other synths I own/have tried" again you're putting words in my mouth or at the very least you didn't consider that I may have been coming at it from a different angle.

[perpetual3]

I really wanted to love it, specs are fantastic. At the end of the day, sound is objective and it just didn’t cut it for me.