KVR Audio

PietW. · Post by **PietW.** » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:31 pm

Hi,

I want to convert the AKWF waveforms (4300 waves) as wavetables for Surge. The question now is how many waveforms in a wavetable. I can max. 33 waveforms into a wavetable but that does not sound good. It would also be possible to convert all waveforms individually but then there would be over 4300 files in the surge folder. I would be glad for suggestions.

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:41 pm

PietW. wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:31 pm Hi,

I want to convert the AKWF waveforms (4300 waves) as wavetables for Surge. The question now is how many waveforms in a wavetable. I can max. 33 waveforms into a wavetable but that does not sound good. It would also be possible to convert all waveforms individually but then there would be over 4300 files in the surge folder. I would be glad for suggestions.

You could use Serum to build wavetables with up to 256 waves (or use just 64 waves, and interpolate them before exporting as a wavetable), export them and then convert them to Surge format using Audio-Term. They will not have 64 waves anymore after conversion, but the wavetables will be much better, IMO.

esaruoho · Post by **esaruoho** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:37 pm

This sounds interesting. BTW, there's still some conversation going on about making macOS Surge capable of supporting drag'n'drop wav in the future - and maybe enhancing the wavetable format to support larger waveforms.

And I came across this one guy from years ago on the vember-audio-forum who wrote a .wav->.wt converter, his name was JimSifu - I haven't been able to figure out how to find him though.

layzer · Post by **layzer** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:05 pm

i'm not a programmer or i would do this: a program that takes a bunch of mono 16bit single-cycle wav files in a folder and randomly assembles them in your desired waveform length .wt files for surge, then dump the assembled .wt's into another folder. would be nice, huh?

PietW. · Post by **PietW.** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:20 pm

With Audioterm you can use wavetables, e.g. for surge of single-cycle waveforms. Either a wavetable of 2 or up to 33 waveforms. Audioterm then interpolates between the waveforms.

esaruoho · Post by **esaruoho** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:07 pm

PietW. wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:31 pm I want to convert the AKWF waveforms (4300 waves)

btw, what's that AKWF pack short for?

fmr · Post by **fmr** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:22 pm

esaruoho wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:07 pm
PietW. wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:31 pm I want to convert the AKWF waveforms (4300 waves)
btw, what's that AKWF pack short for?

Adventure Kid Waveforms

"Adventure Kid is the stage name of Kristoffer Ekstrand (born July 22, 1982). Kristoffer who is based in Sweden uses obsolete personal computers, hand held gaming consoles and video game consoles in
conjunction with modern synthesizers and sequencers to create music and art."

PietW. · Post by **PietW.** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:23 pm

esaruoho wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:07 pm
PietW. wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:31 pm I want to convert the AKWF waveforms (4300 waves)
btw, what's that AKWF pack short for?

https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/wavefo ... waveforms/

esaruoho · Post by **esaruoho** » Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:02 pm

PietW. wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:23 pm
esaruoho wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:07 pm
PietW. wrote: ↑Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:31 pm I want to convert the AKWF waveforms (4300 waves)
btw, what's that AKWF pack short for?
https://www.adventurekid.se/akrt/wavefo ... waveforms/

thanks! i see many people have contributed to his site and done various conversions. would be absolutely awesome to have a surge version of this, too

Gone soft · Post by **Gone soft** » Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:05 pm

PietW. wrote: ↑Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:20 pm With Audioterm you can use wavetables, e.g. for surge of single-cycle waveforms. Either a wavetable of 2 or up to 33 waveforms. Audioterm then interpolates between the waveforms.

But Audioterm reduces the sounds to quite a low number of partials (64) through resynthesis, this considerably reduces the quality of many waveforms or for some renders them practically unrecognisable (I'm thinking generally here, I'm sure for many but probably not all of the AKWFs 64 partials is sufficient). It's great for old school wavetables and I find plenty to love about it, but take it for what it is. It absolutely isn't a full blooded conversion tool and was never meant to be.

PietW. · Post by **PietW.** » Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:42 pm

If you get bad results with Audioterm then you probably have an operator error. True, Audioterm was written to make wavetables for Terratece Komplexer. By the way, the same format as for Harmor (wt) Only with different ID. That's why the limitation to 33 wavetables. In order to achieve good results with Audioterm, the audio file to be converted must be exactly tuned to 86.1 Hz. That's how Audioterm works best. If you stick to the guidelines you can achieve good results with Audioterm. I'll make some wavetables and then everyone can decide for themselves whether he wants to use them or not.
As soon as a "real" wavetable editor for Surge is available you can use it.

esaruoho · Post by **esaruoho** » Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:39 pm

PietW. wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 2:42 pm As soon as a "real" wavetable editor for Surge is available you can use it.

Do you have any opinions as to what a real wavetable editor for Surge would do and what it should have? Sounds interesting.

PietW. · Post by **PietW.** » Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:23 pm

The easiest way would be of course if the Wavetableeditor implemented in Surge but I think the effort is too big. That was not really meant by me because with Audioterm we have a good wavetable editor for Surge. I think many musicians do not use Audioterm properly and therefore produce bad results. I already described it above. On my Facebook page Audioterm there is a lot of information and also small tutorials on how it works. Together with the programmer, we have been developing Audioterm for over 10 years and we can be very happy that AudioTerm even works under Windows 10 because it is actually a DOS program.
Tip. Importing serum wavetables into Audioterm and saving them as surgewavetables will give very bad results. These files need to be customized.
If the Surgecommunity really wants to work with Audioterm as wavetable editor, I am willing to share my knowledge with you all so that everyone can get good results.

esaruoho · Post by **esaruoho** » Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:58 pm

PietW. wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:23 pm If the Surgecommunity really wants to work with Audioterm as wavetable editor, I am willing to share my knowledge with you all so that everyone can get good results.

Well, I recently spent a while fixing the SurgePDF -> SurgeHTML documentation so all the images load properly - the manual is at http://surge-synthesizer.github.io/manual - I have been planning a re-write of the whole documentation.

Would be awesome to have a segment on Audio-Term. How could we make this happen?

PietW. · Post by **PietW.** » Thu Feb 07, 2019 6:13 pm

esaruoho wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 5:58 pm
PietW. wrote: ↑Thu Feb 07, 2019 4:23 pm If the Surgecommunity really wants to work with Audioterm as wavetable editor, I am willing to share my knowledge with you all so that everyone can get good results.
Well, I recently spent a while fixing the SurgePDF -> SurgeHTML documentation so all the images load properly - the manual is at http://surge-synthesizer.github.io/manual - I have been planning a re-write of the whole documentation.

Would be awesome to have a segment on Audio-Term. How could we make this happen?

Please excuse me but what do you mean by segment?

AKWF Waveforms for Surge