KVR Audio

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:45 am

Good idea! Thanks! Let me try it

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:22 am

Oh wow! I can go beyond that I imagined with FM modulations (in general). I wish we have Dune FM in the future! Maybe emaulation of DX1

I can only dream

Anyway back to reality and what I have now

I wish I could control Carla/Dune 3 with my knobs! Unfortunately it only permits me to control with mod wheel.

Richard_Synapse · Post by **Richard_Synapse** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:33 pm

EnGee wrote: ↑Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:22 am Oh wow! I can go beyond that I imagined with FM modulations (in general). I wish we have Dune FM in the future! Maybe emaulation of DX1 I can only dream

Would be cool for sure, I'd certainly love it! Don't know how many people are into vintage-FM stuff though. It's a bitch to create good patches using FM, and few sound designers today seem to have experience with it

Richard

JoaquinAce · Post by **JoaquinAce** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:51 pm

Richard_Synapse wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:33 pm
EnGee wrote: ↑Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:22 am Oh wow! I can go beyond that I imagined with FM modulations (in general). I wish we have Dune FM in the future! Maybe emaulation of DX1 I can only dream
Would be cool for sure, I'd certainly love it! Don't know how many people are into vintage-FM stuff though. It's a bitch to create good patches using FM, and few sound designers today seem to have experience with it

Richard

I for one would love it. FM has an unfair bad wrap for being complicated. It all started when the DX synths (yeah I know thats phase modulation) came out with a manual written by Yamaha engineers for engineers. Not for the general public. FM synthesis is actually pretty straight forward when you have someone who can explain it well. Its like clouds part and the sun comes out (and the light bulb goes on). Please, please please add it to dune3 with 4-7 operators

Whywhy · Post by **Whywhy** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:08 pm

I'm not sure if phase modulation synthesis, with 4 or 7 op, suits well to Dune3 concept:
FM synthesis, like the Dx serie, need one envelope per operators to be really useful...
My 2 cents....

AnX · Post by **AnX** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:17 pm

I think he was referring to a DX1 emu

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:13 pm

Yes I did. I thought it's just a two DX7 put together, but it's more than that. There is a long video about it, although mostly for marketing purposes.

Anyway, it is amazing what complexity can be achieved with such synthesis. But as Richard said, it's not easy to design sounds for it so it might not succeed like the wavetable synthesis.

Whywhy · Post by **Whywhy** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:54 pm

@AnX : you re right!
@Engee : sorry, I misunderstood

DJ Warmonger · Post by **DJ Warmonger** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:07 pm

^Wait, did we have it in Dune 2? As I asked for it

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm

Whywhy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:54 pm @Engee : sorry, I misunderstood

Not entirely

as I did also suggested 4 operators instead of 3 for D3 even before it was released.

Anyway, still the possibilities are great with just 3 operators with the help of the modulation matrix as mentioned before

Richard_Synapse · Post by **Richard_Synapse** » Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:55 pm

EnGee wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm
Whywhy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:54 pm @Engee : sorry, I misunderstood
Not entirely as I did also suggested 4 operators instead of 3 for D3 even before it was released.

Anyway, still the possibilities are great with just 3 operators with the help of the modulation matrix as mentioned before

We thought about 4 operators, the main issue is UI space, increased sound design complexity and the CPU usage when using all 32 oscillators per block (which would amount to 128 operators that must be rendered for 4-op-FM just for a single voice, not yet factoring in multiple layers or using both oscillator blocks).

Richard

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:37 pm

Richard_Synapse wrote: ↑Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:55 pm
EnGee wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm
Whywhy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:54 pm @Engee : sorry, I misunderstood
Not entirely as I did also suggested 4 operators instead of 3 for D3 even before it was released.

Anyway, still the possibilities are great with just 3 operators with the help of the modulation matrix as mentioned before
We thought about 4 operators, the main issue is UI space, increased sound design complexity and the CPU usage when using all 32 oscillators per block (which would amount to 128 operators that must be rendered for 4-op-FM just for a single voice, not yet factoring in multiple layers or using both oscillator blocks).

Richard

Thank you Richard for considering this suggestion

Maybe then it is better to design a new synth with just FM (6 or 8 operators with limited algorithms will do). Something easy to use but powerful.

There are 3 reasons why I think such a synth would be great:
1. Great successor to NI FM8 (NI won't do it).
2. SA effects are great if added to such synth
3. Coding and efficiency are second to none IMO.

The only problem is (as you said) that it wouldn't be easy to program sounds unless it can import DX7 sounds, so sound designers can import and enhance them with arpeggio and effects.

Elektronisch · Post by **Elektronisch** » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:47 pm

EnGee wrote: ↑Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:37 pm
Richard_Synapse wrote: ↑Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:55 pm
EnGee wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:31 pm
Whywhy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:54 pm @Engee : sorry, I misunderstood
Not entirely as I did also suggested 4 operators instead of 3 for D3 even before it was released.

Anyway, still the possibilities are great with just 3 operators with the help of the modulation matrix as mentioned before
We thought about 4 operators, the main issue is UI space, increased sound design complexity and the CPU usage when using all 32 oscillators per block (which would amount to 128 operators that must be rendered for 4-op-FM just for a single voice, not yet factoring in multiple layers or using both oscillator blocks).

Richard
Thank you Richard for considering this suggestion Maybe then it is better to design a new synth with just FM (6 or 8 operators with limited algorithms will do). Something easy to use but powerful.

There are 3 reasons why I think such a synth would be great:
1. Great successor to NI FM8 (NI won't do it).
2. SA effects are great if added to such synth
3. Coding and efficiency are second to none IMO.

The only problem is (as you said) that it wouldn't be easy to program sounds unless it can import DX7 sounds, so sound designers can import and enhance them with arpeggio and effects.

and there are reasons such synth wouldnt be great..

1. Need to know if there is an interest in such synth that would bring profits

2. FM 8 synth sounds just as good as digital can sound

3. There is Bazille, which actually brought something new and interesting to work with territory

You can count me out

omiroad · Post by **omiroad** » Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:54 pm

There's no way FM8 is as good as it gets. The FM can use more oversampling and the filters and effects are outdated.

Elektronisch · Post by **Elektronisch** » Tue Sep 17, 2019 2:13 pm

omiroad wrote: ↑Tue Sep 17, 2019 1:54 pm There's no way FM8 is as good as it gets. The FM can use more oversampling and the filters and effects are outdated.

Lets say it can, Bazille i think already does. How many people would be interested ?

im not against it, i dont care, but lets be realistic ,wishes and dreams are just that, for developer its buisiness and only Synapse can now how much of interest there is in FM synths (doing researches i guess?)

Bazille imo is a good example as it makes this synth fun to program, but it doesnt program like any other FM synth, its more like weird subtractive modular synth

DUNE 3 is now available!!