Structure 2 (vs Halion)

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KTlin wrote:Hi guys

I just got an email from VSTBuzz with a 70% off for Structure 2. I've never checked this sampler and I've hardly seen any mentions about it in the forums. Seems to be very unpopular. Unfortunately Air doesn't offer a demo version on their website, so I can't try it, but I checked some videos and I pretty much like its interface and workflow. One thing that I noticed though, is that it seems to have a very basic modulation section (just two LFOs?).
What are your thoughts? How it compares to Halion for example (especially the modulation capabilities)? Is the 37GB library any good? Does it have keyswitches for different articulations on acoustic patches?

Cheers
I dont own Halion but for the price of 70% off Structure is a good cop. I actually use it for all my non encrypted Kontakt libraries one of its features are
Use your SampleCell, Kontakt, and EXS24 sound libraries* (supports up to 8-channel interleaved samples)
. There are a few third party sound packs as well check out the DUC forums https://www.google.com/search?q=free+so ... 3&bih=1055 (https://www.google.com/search?q=free+sounds+for+structore+2+site:duc.avid.com&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiZ0f7H8vzSAhVQ9WMKHWwQBl4QrQIIKigEMAA&biw=2133&bih=1055)

I would love to get a bunch of EXS24 patches as well for my collection.

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dellboy wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:situation where something was right in front of our eyes but we didn't see it. I suspect that he went into editing the preset trying to turn it off without realizing that it was right on the front panel.
Nope.

I saw that button in a split second.

You can fiddle all you like,but the convo fx is built into the sample.

I would like to be proved wrong though.

What you are hearing as FX is just the sound of the room and the piano itself. I don't really know anything about how the recording was made, it's a very old sample set and goes back to at least Kontakt 2.

http://blog.ultimateoutsider.com/2014/1 ... ianos.html

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dellboy wrote:You can fiddle all you like,but the convo fx is built into the sample.

I would like to be proved wrong though.
It's not. It's just how the piano that was sampled sounds, in a room it was sampled in.

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EvilDragon wrote:
dellboy wrote:You can fiddle all you like,but the convo fx is built into the sample.

I would like to be proved wrong though.
It's not. It's just how the piano that was sampled sounds, in a room it was sampled in.
Thats what I said.

The fx is built into the sample (ie: the room has not been accoustically treated to allow a dry recording). But what I hear is an unpleasant ringing sound that I guess is mic feedback from the amp. All in all its a pretty poor excuse for a piano in 2017, unless of course, someone likes their instruments to be drowned in reverb, but I prefer them to be sampled dry and fx to be applied as desired.

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ghettosynth wrote:
dellboy wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:situation where something was right in front of our eyes but we didn't see it. I suspect that he went into editing the preset trying to turn it off without realizing that it was right on the front panel.
Nope.

I saw that button in a split second.

You can fiddle all you like,but the convo fx is built into the sample.

I would like to be proved wrong though.

What you are hearing as FX is just the sound of the room and the piano itself. I don't really know anything about how the recording was made, it's a very old sample set and goes back to at least Kontakt 2.

http://blog.ultimateoutsider.com/2014/1 ... ianos.html
Thanks for that link,it confirms what I hear,its a dinosaur. But having said that,I remember the old Akai Splendid piano (256 megabytes) sounding way better than the Kontakt one 20 years ago. Lets hope they throw it out for Kontakt 6 (whenever it comes,if ever).

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dellboy wrote: Thanks for that link,it confirms what I hear,its a dinosaur. But having said that,I remember the old Akai Splendid piano (256 megabytes) sounding way better than the Kontakt one 20 years ago. Lets hope they throw it out for Kontakt 6 (whenever it comes,if ever).
Yeah, no worries, I found that site useful when I was trying to sort out my piano sample libraries and what else I "needed."

I'll say this though, while I agree with you that the AIR pianos sound different and are comparable to the Kontakt library pianos, the August Foerster piano has a place. Sometimes I like that dark clangy sort of sound. It's a shade, and sometimes it works.

Hell, I remember when everyone was clamouring for the big sixteen megabyte piano for the Kurzweil K2000. We still made music with it.
Last edited by ghettosynth on Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Requirement 110GB free hard drive space !!!! I have a license but decided it wasn't worth installing on my new machine.

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dellboy wrote:All in all its a pretty poor excuse for a piano in 2017, unless of course, someone likes their instruments to be drowned in reverb, but I prefer them to be sampled dry and fx to be applied as desired.
Kontakt factory library didn't really change much since Kontakt 4 times, and there's still content from K2 and K3 in there. Chances this August Förster piano will be removed in K6 factory library: slim to none.

There are better pianos for Kontakt, naturally, and they come with Komplete.

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EvilDragon wrote:
dellboy wrote:All in all its a pretty poor excuse for a piano in 2017, unless of course, someone likes their instruments to be drowned in reverb, but I prefer them to be sampled dry and fx to be applied as desired.
Kontakt factory library didn't really change much since Kontakt 4 times, and there's still content from K2 and K3 in there. Chances this August Förster piano will be removed in K6 factory library: slim to none.

There are better pianos for Kontakt, naturally, and they come with Komplete.
Absolutely. I don't want to suggest that the AIR stuff is on the level of the additional libraries that come with Komplete, for the most part, it isn't. It does, however, contain a lot of usable sample sets and quite a bit of it doesn't really overlap with the Kontakt factory library.

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ghettosynth wrote:
dellboy wrote:
Hell, I remember when everyone was clamouring for the big sixteen megabyte piano for the Kurzweil K2000. We still made music with it.
That board was a class act.We all wanted one,but I had to settle for a Korg M1.

Life is tough. :(

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EvilDragon wrote: Kontakt factory library didn't really change much since Kontakt 4 times, and there's still content from K2 and K3 in there. Chances this August Förster piano will be removed in K6 factory library: slim to none.

There are better pianos for Kontakt, naturally, and they come with Komplete.
The current Concert Grand is decent enough,and the fx button kills most reverb ok. Lets hope they upgrade the Concert Grand then,although I guess you are shaking your head.

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They won't upgrade it and that is extremely likely, since they produced a number of more detailed piano libraries since then.

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jacqueslacouth wrote:Requirement 110GB free hard drive space !!!! I have a license but decided it wasn't worth installing on my new machine.
The actual library is only 37gb in size :tu: But you need triple the size for the installation, because you first have to download it, then unpack it and then install it.

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There's a pretty big point that's quite noteworthy regarding Structure if you are a Logic Pro X user with another sequencer such as Ableton:

The Sampler flawlessly loads complicated EXS instruments, including modulation, the various velocity layers, and other more complex parameters. I have several 16+ layered pianos that loads in rather quickly, and the same can be said for Orchestral as well as more complex Bass Instruments. The same cannot be said about Ableton's Sampler, or Bitwig's for that matter, and I'm not so sure how well Kontakt handles the translation these days. Structure is a real boon when I'm using Live as I have an EXS Library that's several hundred Gigs. Coupled with the included Factory Library and this Sampler is a winner -- even if you only use it as a Romper like Xpand.

I opted for the AIR Expansion over Live Suite as I currently am using Standard. The latter includes all the platform necessities included WARPing, and the upgrade adds lots of content plus MAX, which I don't really need as I primarily Mix in Logic. I use Live as an experimental sketchpad, though I also Remix in Ableton quite a bit too and often compare with the original Logic Production.

The AIR Expansion is just a better deal, for me, than the Suite as it also comes with the AIR Effects Rack, for lack of a better term, which is pretty darned good. Strike is a huge bonus too, particularly in tandem with Logic's Drummer. I don't use the synths too much, but I'd imagine given the sheer number that many working with other platforms will have plenty of fun.
***************************************
* AKAI, KRK, UAD, Softube Vol 1, Soundtoys
* Live, Logic, Serum, Spire, Dune 2, Hive

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KTlin wrote:Hi guys

I just got an email from VSTBuzz with a 70% off for Structure 2. I've never checked this sampler and I've hardly seen any mentions about it in the forums. Seems to be very unpopular. Unfortunately Air doesn't offer a demo version on their website, so I can't try it, but I checked some videos and I pretty much like its interface and workflow. One thing that I noticed though, is that it seems to have a very basic modulation section (just two LFOs?).
What are your thoughts? How it compares to Halion for example (especially the modulation capabilities)? Is the 37GB library any good? Does it have keyswitches for different articulations on acoustic patches?

Cheers
I picked up Structure 2 last year with the AIR bundle. It was a good deal that allowed me to add a sample library to my instrument collection. For somebody like me that already had a boatload of synths, drums, and weird sounds, but lacked many real-world sampled instruments, this one was a no-brainer.

I don't have Kontakt or Halion, so I can't compare to them, but I doubt it is a contest. If you can afford one of those high end sample libaries, you probably won't regret it. If you already own them, you can probably skip this.

But otherwise, Structure 2 works well. It has that 37GB library, full of great sampled real instruments, but lacks 3rd party expansions. The GUI is a little small and dated. But it is multi-timbral, so you can load it up with as many patches and parts as your computer can handle. :D

The user guide can be downloaded from here: http://www.airmusictech.com/product/structure-2

It has a full featured patch editor with key mapping where you can display and modify the samples within the parts of a patch. You can wave-edit and loop samples, create and modify sample mappings, and adjust individual playback, filter, and amp settings per sample zone.

Each patch has controls for keyswitches, smart knobs (that you can link your MIDI controller to), and MIDI CC's, mod matrix, bus routing, FX sends, etc. As far as the keyswitches go, I haven't noticed any factory presets with them enabled, but the function is there if you want to set it up.

Structure has a decent patch browser and sample database search window. Between this and Xpand!2 I can usually find the real-world sound I am looking for. Xpand!2 is actually a better replacement for a "ROMpler", because it covers more diverse sounds, like synth sounds and weird stuff as well as real instruments. The downside is no sample editing.

Structure 2 could be a decent sampler if you wanted to assemble a new patch from scratch, using existing samples.

But if I actually wanted to record samples and map them, I would probably use the free TX16Wx sampler form CWITEC, as that is what it was designed for.
Windows 10 and too many plugins

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