Speakers/Monitors - Two questions

Anything about hardware musical instruments.
Post Reply New Topic
RELATED
PRODUCTS

Post

Hi,

I used to own a pair of m-audio studiophile av40's but realised early on that trying to use them to mix - especially for the bass (80hz and below) - it was impossible as they couldn't reproduce those lower frequencies. I then sold them due to the fact I couldn't get any mix accurate.

I have two questions:
1. In an average recording music studio, the photos I've seen have two studio monitor speakers either side. Since my only experience with studio monitors have been av40's, which are unable to reproduce bass accurately, are normal studio monitor speakers able to reproduce most of the audible frequencies, including the bass? Or, is there always some subwoofer accompanying?

1. Can anyone suggest the lowest cost studio monitors that can reproduce more accurate sound, especially bass?

Thanks.

Post

I recommend getting a sub if you want accurate monitoring. Something designed to go with your main monitors is probably best. I've been using the same speaker setup for a long time now (18 years) and would hate to mix without the sub. Its worth spending a decent amount on monitors imho. Cheap and accurate doesn't really go together. You need to treat your room too ...

Post

I believe JBL 305 are, but personally I skipped them because they didn't seem with a high built quality.
The other 5" monitors can't produce the bass. So, for me it was between PreSonus E8 (I had e4.5 and I liked them a lot, but no bass) and Yamaha HS7. I liked both but went with the HS7. I only had them for few days but the bass is there and the built quality can't be better :) mind you this series, HS, is the cheapest Yamaha monitors!

Sub is expensive. Buy 6.5" or 8" monitor instead.

Post

Hi maudioradium

On the first question, if you are describing pictures of two pairs of different models of studio monitors, perhaps one pair of big speakers, one each on the left and right-- Then another pair of smaller speakers, one each on both left and right-- People often use 2 or more stereo pairs so they can compare a mix on different sets of speakers.

Maybe work on the mix listening only to the big speaker pair until it sounds good. Then turn off the big speakers and listen to the small speaker pair to discover whether the mix still sounds good. If not, tweak the mix until it sounds good on the little speakers. Then go back to the big speakers to find out whether the most recent mix changes have now made the song sound bad on the big speakers. Keep switching between the different speakers until the mix is adjusted to "as good as possible compromise" on all the speakers. The song sounds equally good (or equally bad) on different kinds of speakers. Rather than sounding "very good" on one kind of speaker but "very bad" on another kind of speaker.

In other words, there may be several sets of speakers, but you only listen to one stereo pair at a time while working.
----
There could also be multi-speaker surround sound setups, but in that case there would typically only be 2 or 3 speakers in front, and the other surround speakers at the sides or back. There are many surround setups. 4 + 1 for instance would be front left and right, rear left and right, plus subwoofer. 5 + 1 would be the same except add a front center channel speaker in-between the front left and front right. There are many other "standardized" surround formats with even more speakers in prescribed places in the room.

So far as I know, surround formats are most common for TV and movies and ordinary stereo is still most common for ordinary music. If you work on audio for video then you probably NEED a surround setup. But if you mostly do music then you probably don't NEED a surround setup.
----
It is good to have speakers with a wide frequency response. If nothing else so that you can hear good enough to avoid bad mistakes. For instance if your speakers can't reproduce low thuds from the singer tapping his foot on the floor, which passes up the mic stand into the mic, then you might think the music sounds fine, but anybody with a good sound system will hear all those low thumps and thuds. Also just to make sure there is "just enough" bass in your music, neither too much nor too little bass.

Really good speakers still won't sound so good in a bad room. It is desirable to treat the room to allow the speakers to sound good. Also, regardless whether the room is treated, a bigger room generally sounds better than a small room. Also, there will be good-sounding speaker locations and bad-sounding speaker locations in the room, and good-sounding and bad-sounding listening locations.

Except for some of the real expensive studio monitors, hardly any of the small monitors output much SPL below about 60 Hz. If you study the published specs of studio monitors-- If a monitor is spec'd something like 38 Hz to 22 kHz, with no dB's mentioned, then you can almost bet good money they are referencing -10 dB frequencies. The audio is -10 dB at 38 Hz and -10 dB at 22 kHz. That means in a not-very-powerful inexpensive small monitor, there probably isn't much USEFUL bass output below about 80 Hz.

IF the spec says something like +/- 3 dB 60 Hz to 15 kHz, then they are probably describing a better speaker than the first example. If they are not lying or being "wildly optimistic".

The ear is not very sensitive to low bass, so if you want to be able to actually HEAR much low bass, you also need to pay attention to the max peak SPL specifications. If a monitor has a max undistorted peak SPL around 115 dB or better, then it ought to be able to cleanly reproduce music at a long-term SPL of about 85 or 90 dB and if they are not lying about the bass spec then the bass will probably be loud enough to clearly hear.

If the max undistorted peak SPL is not listed, or if it is less than maybe 105 dB, then maybe the speaker will be nice and clean sounding with plenty of bass, but maybe it won't get quite loud enough for your ear to appreciate the bass level. Commercial released music has a low ratio of peaks to average level, so you could turn up finished released music fairly loud and play clean on a "not real strong" speaker. But raw music before it is mixed and processed have a much bigger ratio of peaks to average level, so if the speaker can't handle rather loud short peaks without clipping, then you can't get the average level very loud without hearing lots of peak distortion.

The same goes for most commercial small subwoofers. If the subwoofer claims it goes down to 30 Hz but doesn't give a dB reference, then you can bet that it is -10 dB at 30 Hz and probably starts rolling off well above 40 Hz.

Except for some genres such as dance music, there typically isn't much music power below 40 Hz, and lots of released music starts rolling off at 80 Hz. If they released much music with real strong bass, then it would sound bad on customers' small boomboxes or small computer speakers. It would be nice to have a system flat down to 20 Hz, but a monitor system flat down to 40 Hz is probably better than most amateurs (and many pros) work on.

Post

EnGee wrote:I believe JBL 305 are, but personally I skipped them because they didn't seem with a high built quality.
The other 5" monitors can't produce the bass. So, for me it was between PreSonus E8 (I had e4.5 and I liked them a lot, but no bass) and Yamaha HS7. I liked both but went with the HS7. I only had them for few days but the bass is there and the built quality can't be better :) mind you this series, HS, is the cheapest Yamaha monitors!

Sub is expensive. Buy 6.5" or 8" monitor instead.
I'd recommend the HS7s as well. I've had mine for two years and love them. They have the accurate bass response you're looking for. If you want to save a few bucks, buy them on eBay. I bought my pair in the original boxes for about a third less.

Post

It also really depends on the size of the room. I'm delighted with my recent selection of Focal Alpha 50s in my very modest new studio space. I needed to have front-ported monitors as they are forced to live pretty close to the back wall. Could not be happier with the bass response from these once I treated the corners of the room.
expert only on what it feels like to be me
https://soundcloud.com/mrnatural-1/tracks

Post Reply

Return to “Hardware (Instruments and Effects)”