KVR Audio

do_androids_dream · Post by **do_androids_dream** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 9:17 am

chk071 wrote:Tape emulations are so yesterday.

Man you said it lol.. I don't use any these days. I liked Reelbus for a while but then went completely off it. When you loudness match what these things are doing it nearly always sounds better bypassed lol.

TIMT · Post by **TIMT** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 10:25 am

do_androids_dream wrote:
chk071 wrote:Tape emulations are so yesterday.
Man you said it lol.. I don't use any these days. I liked Reelbus for a while but then went completely off it. When you loudness match what these things are doing it nearly always sounds better bypassed lol.

THIS is exactly my findings too,with most all things digital that involve distortion,saturation,harmonic enhancement they all seem to rob sounds of what i would describe as their "size"which becomes very evident when you RMS match things,instead of peak matching.i pretty much cleaned out almost all my digital distortion,saturation plugins and i'm down to like 3 or so(mainly for working on other peoples shit as alas this generation seems to really dig waveshaper distortion pushed to its limits).i do most all the heavy handed end of the spectrum of harmonic enhancement and (f**king sounds up beyond recognition) completely outboard with a splash of Nebula here and there,especially for the tape stuff.i should probably checkout UAD at some point,although i doubt i will ever get around to that

and i'm kinda jaded/fed up with "analogue modelled" plugins in general

Doubleclick · Post by **Doubleclick** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 10:28 am

I'll throw on another vote for U-he's Satin. I love this plugin and it gets used everywhere in everything I do since I got it. It's one of these things that's impossible to judge from compressed audio demos and YouTube reviews, because the qualities it adds are the kinds of things that data compression algorithms throw away.

That said, you have to bear in mind that tape simulators in particular take a long time to assess. I've used quite a few briefly, but it would be wrong for me to sit here and tell you I have broad experience of them or that Satin is the best. All I can truthfully say is that Satin is the one I've used the most, and it will stay that way for years to come because I'm always so happy with the results. That's all that matters, really. There might be another out there that's marginally "better", but even if there is, I have no need for it when what I have is so good.

do_androids_dream · Post by **do_androids_dream** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 10:50 am

Doubleclick wrote: That said, you have to bear in mind that tape simulators in particular take a long time to assess.

Not really imo.. I generally really like the sound of real tape without needing a long time to assess it.

noiseresearch · Post by **noiseresearch** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 11:39 am

/* static noise */

do_androids_dream · Post by **do_androids_dream** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 11:51 am

resistent wrote:I think a lot of people expect sounds from emulation a real tape do not deliver. Also everybody should keep in mind that a good gain staging and careful mixing is necessary to achieve the desired sound.

I'm going to put myself on the line a bit here and destroy this myth.. I've used almost all the tape emus on the market. Either with careful gain staging or by just slapping these plugins on hot mixes - in essence, you get the same sound - just to a lesser or greater degree. Changing the way you gain stage a mix is not going to suddenly change the sonic character of a plugins saturation. I've not been impressed by anything I've tried really - satin included. I would rather run some of my stems through an old cassette machine to get some nice character..

noiseresearch · Post by **noiseresearch** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 12:03 pm

/* static noise */

djmino02 · Post by **djmino02** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 2:08 pm

do_androids_dream wrote:. I would rather run some of my stems through an old cassette machine to get some nice character..

Do you just reamp to a tape machine?

Any recommendations?

FYI, I'm trying to get the sound Tom Dec of BMSR and TOBACCO fame. I hate their songs for the most part, but the sounds he gets are really rad

sprnva · Post by **sprnva** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 2:37 pm

There's a video somewhere of Legowelt putting together a track and he records it out to cassette in a Tascam Portastudio.

soulone82 · Post by **soulone82** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 3:01 pm

do_androids_dream wrote:I would rather run some of my stems through an old cassette machine to get some nice character..

Good luck...

I´ve already done such things just to realize how much I like my tape emulations.

To each his own I guess...

plexuss · Post by **plexuss** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 7:12 pm

Back in the day I would record to tape. My studio set up was a bunch of synths and drum machines midied up to an atari running Notator. I would write my songs by mostly playing into nototar from a master keyboard and routing to a track and then out to the synth I wanted. when I was ready to mix, I'd play back Notator and mix on the fly in realtime using effects on the sub busses on the mixer. I needed many mixer channels and sub busses for the effects. I'd leave the project on the board sometimes for weeks doing mixes, listening, re-doing them with tweeks and changes. There were no plugins and automation so it all had to be done realtime and live. I would record to 456@15ips on a Tascam 3440 with outboard dBx.

When DAT came around, I would mix to DAT. I prefered the sound of tape but I also liked the clarity of DAT. So I came up with this technique of mixing to DAT, boucing to tape and then back to DAT. Something that now is common place but back then was not - when I shared this teqchnique with audio pros they laughed at me because, of course, DAT was the end all and be all of audio. People are fooled so easily.

ITB I have many tape emulations: satin, J37, VTM, Nomad, Kramer and probably some I've forgotten.

Yeah... they basically sound like a tape machine. Its not just the "sound of tape" but the entire machine plus the tape. I mean, you can't hear tape unless you hear it being played back though a tape machine, and that presumably was recorded on a tape machine. so "tape emulation" is not just tape - its the whole electromechanical process.

They all sound different. When used "like tape" the effect should be subtle, because afterall we didn't really want the noise and distortion of tape, back then at least. it was there and it was mostly pleasing but because there were no alternatives, the noise and distortion was not really considered a positive. sorry to burst your bubble. its only now with digital that learn what we were missing and now we want that noise and distortion.

So of all the emulations I listed, I can't say any sound better or worse. I haven't used all the machines and tapes these emulate. I've used various 2-track, 16-track and 24-track machines but not to the degree I would be able to identify a tape/machine configuration in a test. The general sound of a tape machine is created with these plugins... they do impart the character of tape and the effect of varying levels to manage the dynamics, saturation and transients that you can do with tape.

I just mastered a few tracks from back in those Notator/tape days. they are up on soundcloud. The mix was taken off the tape pre-master that was bounced to DAT. They were mastered using contemporary plugins but I retained their original sound and character. There is the occassional tape drop-out too. speaking of which, I have yet to see a tape emulation that includes drop-outs.

i mean if noise and distortion are sought after, why not drop-outs?

https://soundcloud.com/musicofplexus/suttee

https://soundcloud.com/musicofplexus/featherless-flight

Compared to something like this which was done completely ITB but with tape emulation on the mastering:

https://soundcloud.com/musicofplexus/th ... ilizations

Igro · Post by **Igro** » Sat Sep 24, 2016 11:08 pm

Using TB Reelbus on boring drums and for smearing transients. Before i had to use up to 4 plugins to get the same results. It gives this nice melt feeling. Really pleased with its quality.

djmino02 · Post by **djmino02** » Sun Sep 25, 2016 1:39 am

The main reason I'm looking at USD plugs is for the RE201 or Galaxy Echo, not sure why they changed the name. All the demo I've heard of the RE201 sounded amazing, however there aren't lot of demos of the Galaxy plug. I'm hoping it's the same but with different name

Klinke1 · Post by **Klinke1** » Sun Sep 25, 2016 4:02 am

djmino02 wrote:The main reason I'm looking at USD plugs is for the RE201 or Galaxy Echo, not sure why they changed the name. All the demo I've heard of the RE201 sounded amazing, however there aren't lot of demos of the Galaxy plug. I'm hoping it's the same but with different name

Not sure why you did change the name, but it is : UAD..
Galaxy Echo is a new product.. redone. They never changed any name.

djmino02 · Post by **djmino02** » Sun Sep 25, 2016 5:33 am

Klinke1 wrote: Not sure why you did change the name, but it is : UAD..
Galaxy Echo is a new product.. redone. They never changed any name.

so i guess they just discontinued the re-201?

Tape Emulation Plugins