KVR Audio

rubez · Post by **rubez** » Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:28 am

i have heard a lot of stories saying using hardware synths with DAWs are a headache with latency etc.

i am currently using FL 12 and will soon have a Korg Minilogue and a 2i2 interface.

i want to use software effects. a decent/simple noiseless delay (since the Minilogue one sucks) and Valhalla VintageVerb, and maybe Shimmer.

will there be latency?

i will also (later on) want to use the Minilogue in tracks. probably i would like to paint in midi notes roughly on the keyboard into the DAW, then i can quantize/edit - since i don't have good timing to be able to record it as audio.

what problems do i face?

thanks.

thecontrolcentre · Post by **thecontrolcentre** » Wed Jul 20, 2016 10:53 am

If you're using an ASIO audio interface with midi connection then latency shouldn't be a problem. I use lots of hardware synths and effects with Live 9 and an NI Audio Kontrol and have no issues. Live has external instrument tracks and external fx returns.

rubez · Post by **rubez** » Wed Jul 20, 2016 11:19 am

i know Ableton is probably the best for instruments. i seen it had a delay compensation feature. but i find it extremely hard to use. i'd like to keep using FL if possible, though the 2i2 audio interface does comes with Ableton Lite.

the Minilogue has midi over USB, and presumably midi over cable. what one should i use? it doesn't have audio over USB.

thecontrolcentre · Post by **thecontrolcentre** » Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:01 pm

I would use a midi cable, mainly because I always have, but also to save USB ports for other things. I don't think it matters latency wise.

saturdaysaint · Post by **saturdaysaint** » Wed Jul 20, 2016 3:46 pm

I'm not an FL expert, but I'd bet money you can do everything you want in it.

This seems to be what you'll need use to send MIDI from FL to your Minilogue - https://www.image-line.com/support/FLHe ... 20Out.htm.

Start by configuring that. Send the audio from the Minilogue to a speaker/amp while you figure out how to make the MIDI output work.

The next step will be sending the audio output into an audio input on your 2i2. First let us know if you have MIDI working.

ZapAxe · Post by **ZapAxe** » Sat Jul 23, 2016 2:40 pm

I'm no expert, and I don't get too deep doing this, but I use my keyboard/synth, and some midi sound modules with my Cubase DAW. While some pieces of midi gear have more latency than others, even the worst isn't that bad. Using midi off-set on the recorded midi track is one way to compensate, the other is just to nudge the recorded audio .wav if it's noticeably out of alignment.

I mostly use VSTi's, but there are sounds from my hardware I like to use as well. All my midi instrument controllers midi DIN's get plugged into my 8 IN/8 Out midi router, then I send one of the midi DIN's of this router, into my sound cards midi. Any of my midi sound modules, or keyboard/synth get fed midi from my router as well, the midi being generated from my recorded Cubase midi tracks.

I think the worst part about using hardware synths and midi sound modules, is the lack of recall you get with virtual synths etc. As far as the hassles of sending midi to & from, and routing the audio from the sound sources into the DAW, that's of little concern really.

rubez · Post by **rubez** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 2:20 pm

saturdaysaint wrote:I'm not an FL expert, but I'd bet money you can do everything you want in it.

This seems to be what you'll need use to send MIDI from FL to your Minilogue - https://www.image-line.com/support/FLHe ... 20Out.htm.

Start by configuring that. Send the audio from the Minilogue to a speaker/amp while you figure out how to make the MIDI output work.

The next step will be sending the audio output into an audio input on your 2i2. First let us know if you have MIDI working.

i seem to be getting midi, as when i press keys and knobs the DAW flashes an indicator. orange and green.

though no sound at all from the synth. should i be able to hear the synth just plugged into the back of the 2i2, and my headphones jacked in the front? because i don't even get that. the minilogue is mono, so only one cable. tried both L & R on the 2i2.

tehlord · Post by **tehlord** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 3:43 pm

Ableton Live has an external hardware plugin that allows you to route audio and midi on the same channel. It also allows you to compensate for latency within the same plugin.

Yes you will have latency, it's part of the deal when using hardware.

It doesn't need to be an issue if you know how to work around it though.

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:38 pm

rubez wrote:will there be latency?

i will also (later on) want to use the Minilogue in tracks. probably i would like to paint in midi notes roughly on the keyboard into the DAW, then i can quantize/edit - since i don't have good timing to be able to record it as audio.

Your timing will be realtime if you don't use DAW effects. Just track clean, then apply effects later.

FWIW, the Focusrite Clarett, Lynx Thunderbolt, are Apogee Ensemble Thunderbolt are able to use DAW effects realtime. Universal Audio, MOTU, RME, and Steinberg have interfaces with their own DSP effects that are realtime.

thecontrolcentre · Post by **thecontrolcentre** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 4:43 pm

rubez wrote: though no sound at all from the synth. should i be able to hear the synth just plugged into the back of the 2i2, and my headphones jacked in the front? because i don't even get that. the minilogue is mono, so only one cable. tried both L & R on the 2i2.

The L&R connections on the back of the 2i2 are monitor outputs, not audio inputs. Plug the synth into one of the inputs on the front of the unit.

rubez · Post by **rubez** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 5:31 pm

wow, how unbelievably stupid. plugged it into the front and it works now

added valhalla vintageverb quickly to test it out and it works great. zero latency as far as i can tell. instant improvement in the sound, the minilogue sounds pretty raw normally.

adding the reverb even helped cut down drastically on the white noise i was getting from it... although adding a chorus and i get a flanged background noise

many thanks

treebeard · Post by **treebeard** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 5:59 pm

Yeah, you should be ok with fx like reverb and delays. It gets more important to have the latency properly compensated when your running out to outboard compressors to do parallel processing - then even slight differences in phase will have dramatic effects on the signal.

Lejurai · Post by **Lejurai** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 6:54 pm

Reason or Bitwig. Reaper is also very light and quick to set up.

thecontrolcentre · Post by **thecontrolcentre** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:04 pm

Make sure the input on the 2i2 is set to line (not instrument) and that the gain is set correctly. Not setting up properly can add noise to the signal.

rubez · Post by **rubez** » Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:10 pm

yeah i had it on line. the noise comes from the minilogue itself, even when only a pair of headphones are plugged in and nothing else.

other users report it being silent, which mines is most definitely not - it has significant noise at only half way volume, turn the knob any higher, forget about it. so maybe i got a bum unit or something.

DAW for hardware synth effects