Mixbus 32C Released

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jinotsuh wrote:
Bhan wrote:and - that's what they're selling.
What they are selling is a resource hungry, buggy, flakey DAW with poor vst/vsti support.

I think we all know the reason why there is no demo, because after that there would be very few customers, not that there is that many now, and after releasing this, which to me is a bit of a slap in the face to mixbus owners and just a money grab, they have one less customer. The sound, all be it good, is not worth the hassle and frustration. Plus I am getting very good results from Studio Ones mix engine fx/console shapper, not the same 'sound' as mixbus, but an equally good one, don't know how to explain it, but to me it's more punchy, more depth, more real, and with more plugins on the way for mix engine fx it should only get better.

Harrison and Mixbus . . . . pppphhhhhh . . . no thanks, I'll sit this one out . . . permanently
The sound of Mixbus was a good selling point once. Together with its workflow solution, it was one of the best platform for mixing that I have experienced. But after Studio One implemented the Mix Engine FX I do not see any use for Mixbus anymore, as the Mix Engine FX make Studio One a Mixbus that is much more stable and have a good enough workflow.

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fmr wrote:
Bhan wrote:I'm thinking about getting it. Harrison operates like Samplitude in that it's plugs are locked to the host. I like the sound and that's what I'd be buying. They're protecting their intellectual property and - that's what they're selling.
Ahem... actually, and although I had my issues with Magix in the past regarding Samplitude, they have their plug-ins (at least the ones that are really important) available in VST format, so no, they are not "locked" to their host.

Besides, Harrison released this out of the blue, without having the "regular" version (or now abandoned version? - they didn't clarify what will happen to the regular Mixbus) really stable, and asking a steep price for what seems not that much different (or am I missing something?).

What the hell is this, Harrison? After a very ambitious road map announced for Mixbus that is yet to bee fulfilled (the updates are coming at a very slow pace) now you come up with something else?
excellent post.

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Only 32 Cent. I'll think about it.
Anyone who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.

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Mixbus is basically a strip channel plug-in added to Ardour (from which we have as many instances as we have tracks). Mixbus 32C is more of the same, except that the strip channel is a little better in the EQ part (but the compressor part is still very basic). For around the same price or a little more than what they are asking we have lots of strip channels available as plug-ins to be used in whatever host we want, any of them (hosts) much more stable and feature packed than Mixbus. I recently tried the bx_console from Plugin Alliance, that has also na excelente sound, and far more features.

It costs more, but if we are patient, we will probably be able to get it for less than this.
Last edited by fmr on Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Fernando (FMR)

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and that's the real reason why there is no demo...

for one.. someone could buy it cause it looks great and hate the workflow. For two, i doubt anyone would buy it if they demoed it, cause i have never read as many complaints of bugginess for any software in my life as i read for mixbus. It's unheard of. So let's release a new version with expanded eq and bus count, charge almost 4x the price, and still offer no demo :dog:

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scalawag wrote:From product page:
"Is there a downloadable demo for Mixbus?

No, we do not currently provide a demo of Mixbus32C. It is our experience that learning a new DAW is a significant investment in a professional's time. We require that users purchase Mixbus32C, and we provide fast email support to help our customers install Mixbus and learn to use it effectively."
That argument makes no logical sense whatsoever - the fact that people need to invest time to learn to use it and can get fast support has absolutely no bearing on the provision of a demo, they are unrelated issues. If anything it's an argument for a reasonable demo period and clear manual/tutorials being available.

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aMUSEd wrote:
scalawag wrote:From product page:
"Is there a downloadable demo for Mixbus?

No, we do not currently provide a demo of Mixbus32C. It is our experience that learning a new DAW is a significant investment in a professional's time. We require that users purchase Mixbus32C, and we provide fast email support to help our customers install Mixbus and learn to use it effectively."
That argument makes no logical sense whatsoever - the fact that people need to invest time to learn to use it and can get fast support has absolutely no bearing on the provision of a demo, they are unrelated issues. If anything it's an argument for a reasonable demo period and clear manual/tutorials being available.
Of course not. Besides, to check if a certain DAW will answer our own requisites we don't need to "learn" it so deeply. It would be enough to check those functions that are standard in ANY DAW, and we all know which they are and where to look for them (unless they aren't there, or do not work as supposed). This is just a poor excuse.
Fernando (FMR)

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OK, since I just couldn't figure it out, I pasted the feature list from mixbus and mixbus32C next to each other for comparison. So based purely on that, here's what's new in mixbus32C that's not in mixbus:
http://harrisonconsoles.com/site/mixbus32c.html vs. http://harrisonconsoles.com/site/mixbus.html
  • Mixbus32C has an optimized signal flow with 12 stereo mix buses and a master bus, all featuring Tone controls, Compression, Sidechaining, and Analog Tape Saturation simulation [tape saturation sim is only on the master bus with mixbus]
  • Phase, Input trim, Sweepable 4-band EQ [up from three] with second order HP and LP filters , Compression, and 12 mix bus sends [up from 8]on every track
  • Multi-core and 64-bit [actually down from mixbus, which offers 32bit support too] optimizations provide increased track counts across all OS platforms
  • Mixbus32C will open Mixbus sessions. However, the EQ will not covert since they are completely different.
The part about "Fourth-generation Harrison "True Analog Mixing™" processing engine with enhanced compressor/limiter algorithms; built-in sidechain busing, and increased plugin flexibility" is in both feature lists but with Mixbus 32C it's fourth on the list of features, in mixbus it doesn't come until halfway down the list (but it's there).

The rest of the feature list is identical between the two. Basically it seems that it adds Tape Saturation sim on all busses plus new EQs. And four more busses.

:shrug:
Last edited by wasi on Fri Apr 29, 2016 4:53 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Gawd, could you put the edit and the quote button any closer together?

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wasi wrote:Gawd, could you put the edit and the quote button any closer together?
Speak up man :)

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fmr wrote:
aMUSEd wrote:
scalawag wrote:From product page:
"Is there a downloadable demo for Mixbus?

No, we do not currently provide a demo of Mixbus32C. It is our experience that learning a new DAW is a significant investment in a professional's time. We require that users purchase Mixbus32C, and we provide fast email support to help our customers install Mixbus and learn to use it effectively."
That argument makes no logical sense whatsoever - the fact that people need to invest time to learn to use it and can get fast support has absolutely no bearing on the provision of a demo, they are unrelated issues. If anything it's an argument for a reasonable demo period and clear manual/tutorials being available.
Of course not. Besides, to check if a certain DAW will answer our own requisites we don't need to "learn" it so deeply. It would be enough to check those functions that are standard in ANY DAW, and we all know which they are and where to look for them (unless they aren't there, or do not work as supposed). This is just a poor excuse.
EXACTLY.

zero logical sense.. it's a rouse as many suspect, to get people to buy an unstable product.

The fact that harrison can't seem to comprehend that one needs to test it on THEIR computer to see if it is stable, let alone if they like the workflow or not, is impossible to believe.. because it IS impossible. They just feel they will sell more product without a demo, nothing more nothing less. I trust them about as far as i can throw them.

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I'm surprised that they still didn't change their course really.


Harrison MixBus 1 (Mac and Linux only) was darn buggy - I've used it at a clients rig and we lost SEVERAL PROJECTS just because the host refused to load them. This version cost 50bucks (street, around the time v1.5 hit and the Linux version was released).

Not even four months later (post v1.5), they already released Mixbus 2 and upped the price to 219USD (upgrade for 99USD!). The same bugs, still no Windows version. This got a lot of flack already, not only due to the fact that the host's backbone was "Ardour" - an open source host (have you read the GearSlutz posts?! Oh boy, sure wasn't "nice" commentary back then)

Then the (beta) Windows version came along, parallel to that "specific Harrison Mixbus exclusive" plugins - for 79USD a pop! (called XTools). A little bit later, with the 2.5 updates, more exclusive plugins for v2.5+ for 109USD. Still no stable Windows version. Parallel to that, host price got mysteriously slashed in half (now 109USD).

During Winter NAMM 2016, v3 was presented and immediately sold. It's currently priced "188USD MSRP", however goes for "79USD street".


But wait, there is Myrrh!

Now we have the "Mixbus32C Digital Audio Workstation" - for a "mere" 299USD, which comes bundled with two additional plugins ( Harrison Dyno-Mite and x42 SetBFree Tonewheel Organ - according to the shop). The best Mixbus there is!



They now expect 300USD for yet another revision, or how they put it "the big version", just because it's the 32C EQ? No demo because "users need to learn from scratch anyway"?! What bollocks argument is that?!

And the sad thing is... people still SUPPORT developers that pull that kind of crap. "Oh... I added a new feature, 4 months post release... please pay for the upgrade". It happened way too often on KVR alone. We continue this, and the developers have free roam (same happened in the gaming realm with "Early Access" and "DLC" - unfinished, broken products, that will never be fixed!)


Now if they'd drop the collaboration with UAD (like Roland did), then this would be a different topic. But seriously?! They CONFIRMED that VST plugins of their tools are possible. And other developers proved for the same money (or just a fraction of it), how "console suites" can work as part of a production. It's still plugins "branded" into a buggy host (see what happened with Propellerheads RECORD). Oh wow, you can "hide" similar (to my understanding) with modular subhosts (custom guys) or even Reaper (skinning) - yet it's still plugins. It feels like Waves is working with Abbey Road, "hardcode" the REDD or TG12345 console into ARDOUR and selling it for 500bucks as well. Oh wait, better not give them any ideas.


As good as Harrison might be (or was) hardware wise, this is worse than Steinberg's 4 month delayed v x.0 demos of Cubase/Nuendo plus the yearly upgrade fees (no v.1 and v.2 versions in between - straight to v.5!). Even subscription schemes from Cakewalk look like child's play in comparison.

:dog:
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Harrison has a $149 "limited time" (unstated deadline) upgrade offer now they sent by email.

But still, just to get 4 more busses and the emulated 4-band EQ from their desk for $149 seems steep, especially with no demo, and no reworking of the audio engine itself or other stuff, and, no "reworked and re-written from the found up" type of stuff. That's what this boils down to — 4 more busses and the emulated 4-band EQ from their desk.

I am interested, but too many other things to get now. I'm hoping they’ll run the $149 upgrade again.

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And as usual (with a lot of companies), no refund policy?
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Compyfox wrote:And as usual (with a lot of companies), no refund policy?
absolutely not.... it's buy it at your own risk completely here

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