KVR Audio

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 1:05 am

yeah i tried there and they only ship to NZ

will keep looking though!

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 1:13 am

OMG i m going to be playing everything with zero latency and cpu load just like the old days! I am SO Excited.

The other thing is, if i manage to stick to this - i will NEVER have to upgrade my computer or even OS really, i mean, does anyone think any future logic will ever offer new midi features? I personally doubt it!
Well ok, maybe the os hehe. But it does negate at least some of the spend.

I think the nord lead is definitely going to secure the third slot, as to me they simply are the diva of hardware VA's. I am searching around for a version 2 as they had 3rd party editors for those even (and i sat on one and went through EVERY SOUND back when the 2 was released, and i was gobsmacked, oh, i had 2 ears then LOL), but it means i would need to go old school and buy an extra midi interface rather than all USB, to do sysx dumps. So i will probably just cave in and get the A1 rack , it has 26 polyphony (all the time, so not unpredictable like TI's), so that's pretty massive, and has decent editors. Hopefully someone will make a plugin editor some day, but considering no one did for the NL3- - maybe that doesn't bode well for the NL4 and NLA1.. oh well!

edit: some nord a1 examples - and this guy is planning on sharing his 50 patches (not to mention it comes with 500 factory sounds too

)

Sounds FAB to me!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gaEhAtxzgw

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 1:37 am

TheoM wrote:yeah i tried there and they only ship to NZ
will keep looking though!

Oh! Good luck then in your search. why don't you buy them one after another, not all at the same time?

P.S. I would take the Nord A1 Keys if I were you! I heard so much about the keys quality which will make your music playing so enjoyable. Anyway, I like to have two keys connected with USB to the computer, so I can control one instrument with two keys if I want to!

... and you are right. You won't need that powerful computer and that advanced DAW! I was happy with just S1 Artist and my Blofeld/Casio! Completely different workflow than before the hardware! Now, I don't care if that soft synth doesn't work in this OS or that OS! I just need basic things from the software, and Midi/Audio tracks from the Sequencer! Not that much bells and whistles. Simple but lovely workflow

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 2:13 am

EnGee wrote:
TheoM wrote:yeah i tried there and they only ship to NZ
will keep looking though!
Oh! Good luck then in your search. why don't you buy them one after another, not all at the same time?

P.S. I would take the Nord A1 Keys if I were you! I heard so much about the keys quality which will make your music playing so enjoyable. Anyway, I like to have two keys connected with USB to the computer, so I can control one instrument with two keys if I want to!

... and you are right. You won't need that powerful computer and that advanced DAW! I was happy with just S1 Artist and my Blofeld/Casio! Completely different workflow than before the hardware! Now, I don't care if that soft synth doesn't work in this OS or that OS! I just need basic things from the software, and Midi/Audio tracks from the Sequencer! Not that much bells and whistles. Simple but lovely workflow

hey mate, of course they will be bought one at a time

if it takes me year to decide so be it, but this topic was more to compile (and hopefully be a useful resource for everyone here too!), hardware synths with integrated plugin editors

The research part after is half the fun! Just wanted a place to start

Still only the TI and Integra are for sure, the integra is a must cause it means i can rehash all my songs from the 90's that has some signature JV sounds like "flying waltz". I was never able to find a replacement for that in 14 years! my JV was the one box i didn't sell, i meant to keep it always, but it was stolen

So i was very excited to see the integra.

I already have 2 master keyboards, and i really love the yamaha KX61.. what can the nord keyboard give me over it, and just like the yamaha the nord does NOT have aftertouch at all (nor is capable of receiving it from other keyboards), so i can't see a big advantage in spending the extra money there tbh. I need to buy a 3 tier keyboard stand and that's all I ever want to have, with the rest in those rack cases. And i am reserving the third keyboard space for if i can ever find a perfect condition AN1X

Thanks so much for your thoughts and advice though! Keep rocking! PS my entire space is limited to 4.0x3.8 metres, for everything including portable acoustic treatment. As i am not allowed to do anything to the walls.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 3:55 am

That's lovely then. With Ti and Integra and 2 midi keys + Logic you are more than 90% covered for any genre

It's actually very similar to my setup! But one difference between us is I really dislike aftertouch! I have it with the Blofeld and I don't use it at all! I'll try actually to map the sustain pedal to mod wheel tonight so my hands be free playing

So, Nord A1 has no aftertouch?!! Who would imagine that! I think King Korg also has no AT.
Anyway, I better get that Pulse 2 before the prices go up. It always starts in AU then get to NZ!

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 4:25 am

TheoM wrote:just checked them.. 4 voices for that sort of money, i will pass. that said if it had 12 voices, i would have been very interested.

It's the first time an analog synth can be used with Virus TI-style integration. I get that this isn't a crucial thing for you but it's a pretty big deal for those of us who want to use our VST processing plugins on a live analog instrument.

What about Dave Smith Instruments? Those have editors (I don't know if they're AU/Mavericks compatible) and we're blowing out the Evolver, Tetra, Mopho, Mopho Keyboard, and Mopho Keyboard SE.

Also, how about the Roland System-1?

I think the nord lead is definitely going to secure the third slot, as to me they simply are the diva of hardware VA's. I am searching around for a version 2

I've still got my old Nord Lead 2. It's got a different sound from the 2X and later versions.

I already have 2 master keyboards, and i really love the yamaha KX61.. what can the nord keyboard give me over it

Wooden pitch stick and stone modulation wheel!

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 5:55 am

Uncle E wrote:
TheoM wrote:just checked them.. 4 voices for that sort of money, i will pass. that said if it had 12 voices, i would have been very interested.
It's the first time an analog synth can be used with Virus TI-style integration. I get that this isn't a crucial thing for you but it's a pretty big deal for those of us who want to use our VST processing plugins on a live analog instrument.

What about Dave Smith Instruments? Those have editors (I don't know if they're AU/Mavericks compatible) and we're blowing out the Evolver, Tetra, Mopho, Mopho Keyboard, and Mopho Keyboard SE.

Also, how about the Roland System-1?

I think the nord lead is definitely going to secure the third slot, as to me they simply are the diva of hardware VA's. I am searching around for a version 2
I've still got my old Nord Lead 2. It's got a different sound from the 2X and later versions.

I already have 2 master keyboards, and i really love the yamaha KX61.. what can the nord keyboard give me over it
Wooden pitch stick and stone modulation wheel!

dave smith a strong contender.. so is elektron, as the plugin integration IS in fact important to me, ti total integration would be the bomb for all of them if possible.
With shipping and customs, cause of the weak aud, they will go over 1000 aud, there will be lots of costs, i can't see any advantage in buying there vs locally right now. A year+ back it was a much different story, but of course i decide to go to hardware when the dollar drops LOL!

i realise the NL2 is unique and the favourite overall of the nords, hence why i was looking around at them. The NL2 is the one i have experience with and love, but the A1 sounds fab in it's own right too.

system 1, they are all options. But if i decide on elektron for example i will not get system 1 too. I only need 1 real analog.

System 1 is virtual anyway isn't it? Plugins? And so far all mono synths, which aren't really my thing.

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 6:25 am

TheoM wrote:System 1 is virtual anyway isn't it? Plugins? And so far all mono synths, which aren't really my thing.

System-1 is 4-voice and all the plug-outs are mono.

The new Boutique models are poly and chainable for high polyphony but I don't know if they will have plugin editors.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Sat Oct 10, 2015 7:30 am

Uncle E wrote:
TheoM wrote:System 1 is virtual anyway isn't it? Plugins? And so far all mono synths, which aren't really my thing.
System-1 is 4-voice and all the plug-outs are mono.

The new Boutique models are poly and chainable for high polyphony but I don't know if they will have plugin editors.

i was reading they had like 8, yes EIGHT presets each, the plug out stuff and the hardware itself LOL.

what's the best price you can do on a ti desktop? coupons aren't working on it. PM me if you want to work something out.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 2:49 pm

Ok guys you won't believe it but I just had to source a korg 05r/w so i could re create some of my classic tunes and i can't believe i found one. Aesthetically perfect condition, seller has perfect feedback and sells only old japanese sound modules and KB's. Said he just gave it a brand new battery and it works 100%.

180 AUD all up including trackable courier from Japan to OZ.

So i have kind of left the so called "must have plugin" version vision.. and gone back to a 20 YO midi only sound module.LOL. And with the Nord A1, that will be two things I don't have plugin editors for.

So what do you guys think of the final rundown:

Hardware Synths:

Korg 05RW (it has the patch 'sax heaven', trust me it's worth it just for that).
Virus TI2 desktop or snow, just trying to arrange finances but defo one or the other
Elektron Analog Four
Novation Mininova
Nord A1 Rack
Roland Integra 7

Software Synths:
Rob Papen RG, Sub Boom, Predator, Blue2, RAW
NI Kontakt 5 with a few specific purpose orchestral and guitar/piano libraries
Korg Wavestation

I am getting rid of absolutely everything else. What do you reckon? I won't lie, if i ever find a perfect condition yamaha an1x, i will buy it as that machine means a lot to me and holds alot of memories, and i will always regret selling it. But otherwise, I want to narrow my 100+ softsynth library to everything above.
Truth be told, my RP stuff is NFR, long story, so why not use what I *can't* sell, and sell other synths instead. Those 5 RP synths cover a lot of ground. And i think 90% of my basslines anyway will be coming from Elektron, Virus and Nord. Acoustic drums will be via logic's drummer, and groove agent 4 in cubase. Electronic Drums will be done via my many samples choices and microtonic which is not re-sellable.

Plugin FX will be reduced to: UAD various, Logic factory, Cubase Factory, The glue, the Drop, Glitch 2, Glitch Bitch, Tape Stop, Artillery, Turnado, Acon EQ,Bitspeek, and finally ozone advanced for mastering, and acon restore for any minor NR i may need which does not happen often.

Everything else is going, everything! Channel compressors will all be done through UAD + Logic's incredibly excellent factory compressor. Character EQ's all through UAD also.

I feel better already, like a weight has been lifted off, ya know. I feel like I am going back to the way things were in 1998 when i was happy and made great music and always found the sound I needed quickly.

The only thing i am finally debating on is whether to keep Halion Sonic 2 or Sampletank 3 as an all purpose ITB rompler for when I am on the laptop and not at home with hardware access.. I guess it makes sense to keep just one of those? Which one would you guys keep of the two? and can you see any holes in my setup? I can't, but I am biased of course.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:10 pm

TheoM wrote: edit: some nord a1 examples - and this guy is planning on sharing his 50 patches (not to mention it comes with 500 factory sounds too )

Sounds FAB to me!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gaEhAtxzgw

If this was a random VSTi, people would complain about the thin sound probably.

I like it though. Must admit that i probably can get there and beyond with any of my more expensive VSTi's though. Plus the advantages it brings to work in the box. But then, each to his like, i can well understand the attraction of knob twisting.

Uncle E · Post by **Uncle E** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:21 pm

Prepare the marketplace, Theo is back with another one of his fabulous sell-offs! Please PM me about anything you're selling.

That sounds like an excellent system. Will you be going straight into an interface or will you be using a line mixer? If the latter, I recommend getting something that at least has mute automation.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:49 pm

Uncle E wrote:Prepare the marketplace, Theo is back with another one of his fabulous sell-offs! Please PM me about anything you're selling.

That sounds like an excellent system. Will you be going straight into an interface or will you be using a line mixer? If the latter, I recommend getting something that at least has mute automation.

uad apollo 8 is the current lead choice.. i get 8 analog in's only but will add another 8 via adat, and have realtime uad processing on all the synths, plus i can simply save uad/apollo sessions alongside the logic projects with the same name, and have true total recall. Also even without a vst editor, i can send a midi program message at the start of the song for the korg, so it will load up the right patch automatically. It's too tiny a screen and limited to tweak anyway, it's all about the on board sounds with that one.

I looked at hardware mixers and it's going to be a bit of a nightmare IMO - decent ones with project recall run the cost of the apollo (unless I am missing something).

A cheaper option is the RME 802 which has 12 analog ins, and also has adat compatibility to add extra (reality is I need about 16 to be comfortable, and an apollo 16 is almost 6K here and i need to buy db 25 outs for it anyway as it only has the connectors, and no pres - and i want the uad unison mic pres for vocals so if i go that way it has to be the apollo 8. I just wish i could afford TWO apollo 8 quads.. that would give me 16 ins and 8 cores of processing, oh well).

RME also has verb/eq/dynamics and total recall but total mix looks like a clusterfuck complexity wise vs the elegant apollo to be honest, and it is usb/firewire, but no thunderbolt. (would use a thunderbolt dock). Even after buying the thunderbolt dock the RME is a thousand cheaper than the apollo 8.

Lastly, the option that really got me excited was the steinberg UR824. 8 ins and you can cascade 2 units via adat. I could have had both for a thousand less again than the RME 802 on it's own, and have excellent EQ/dynamics,ReverbX, but of course, i just found out the Pres can not be bypassed via the line ins

Then there is the AVB motu 16 analog, or 828x, but guess what, only one thunderbolt port

I need something with a pass through.

UAD seem to be the only lot doing it properly.. dual thunderbolt ports, awesome real time FX, easy "print with FX or print dry" one click selection, easy to use mixer, great sound, and the thunderbolt ports are even powered so you can hang a bus powered drive off of the end. Which I need to do. Have lacie rugged thunderbolt SSD, portables. Awesome drive and no fan. And plenty fast.

BUT.. caveat with UAD is the price.. and.... they have the lowest I/O count vs price of any of them. I mean i know for a fact the RME 802 converters are just as high quality as the Apollo's.

So ANY suggestions would be MOST welcome Eric. Even outboard mixer (but it would HAVE to have project recall including faders), preferable an interface with ultra low latency dsp (at minimum a reverb and dynamics), so i can monitor all the synths in realtime and then record them straight into logic super easy. I want to bypass HOST DAW monitoring all together.

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chk071, if that sounds thin to you, we have different taste - totally. I am NOT doing this vs native for SOUND by the way (did you just see what 20 yo tiny rompler module i just bought?

)
SO yeah, with my setup, absolutely no need to have a "vst can do that" debate at all

This is about limiting myself and having knobs to tweak and knowing myself - that since i started this when i was 17 (now almost 43), the best stuff i ever wrote was before i went VSTi crazy.

chk071 · Post by **chk071** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 3:58 pm

TheoM wrote: SO yeah, with my setup, absolutely no need to have a "vst can do that" debate at all

Didn't want to start that anyway, at all.

Everyone should feel free to use whatever suits them the best. I've flirted a long time with getting a Virus, but the model i'd want is too expensive for me atm. Maybe that'll change one day. But if then i'd get something with a keyboard and a lot of knobs, otherwise, for me, the benefit over VSTi's wouldn't be there. E.g. a Snow just wouldn't cut it for me, as i'd end up using the VST editor the whole time anyway.

ObsoleteAcc99 · Post by **ObsoleteAcc99** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:45 pm

i gotta say the yamaha 01v 96i is looking like a very interesting option.

16 analog inputs and 8 more through the inexpensive expansion card (and i can add another 8 via adat, i'd have to deal with master clock issues then though IMO and all that jazz).

Very hard to find here, at none of the major stores like storedj or turramurra music for some reason, but a few specialists have it. Basically 3.5K aud for the 24 inputs before negotiation. I am sure i can knock 10% off.

Also has sweet ass effects on board. Full channel strips, verb etc. Apparently has sweet pres too.

The RME 802 is just under 3K.

The apollo 8 is 3,200 and to get 2 would be well 6K even with heavy negotiations, and still then only 16 analog input.

The apollo 16 is ridiculous, it's like almost 6k on it's own.

The yamaha has total recall and motorized faders. I guess there are 2 caveats : I'd have to scroll to get to the extra 8 io as there are 16 main channel faders. Not a big deal, i presume they update automatically as you scroll to the next "bank" of i/o. Also it has usb 2.0 - whereas with an interface i have everything plugged in and can record every single hardware track in one pass on different audio tracks in the DAW.. i need to check whether the yamaha usb drivers sees all the various inputs, if it's compatible with usb 3 ports, and if the driver is any good. Otherwise i would use the analog out and that would go back to old days of track by track recording.

the main mixer/interface choice, is what I am finding more difficult than absolutely anything else.

Anyone using arturia hardware instruments? Also, instruments besides virus that have AU editors?