Anything Virtual vs Anything Analogue...the continuation.

[ImNotDedYet]

No talent? Yep, guilty. I have no talent. But that same amount of no talent sounds just as good, if not better, with VSTs than it did with analog synths.

It's not really a fair comparison because obviously you've learned a lot about synthesis since you were playing with your knobs and levers. You haven't touched a hardware synth in a long time based on the fact you didn't even know you'd sold all of them.

So...I'd be more curious to see what you're capable of doing with a hardware/analog synth today vs what you can do ITB today. THAT would be a much better comparison.

I'm a lot better at a number of things today than I was when I was in college. Can't really compare skills when I had no clue what I was doing then, to today when I at least know a bit more what I'm doing.

[Mutant]

How about virtual + analog ?
Do yourself a favor and get any good soft synth out of your computer, to some old tube amplifier and big non- full-range speaker.
What you will hear will be more analog than a real analog connected straight into your DAW.

[wagtunes]

No talent? Yep, guilty. I have no talent. But that same amount of no talent sounds just as good, if not better, with VSTs than it did with analog synths.

It's not really a fair comparison because obviously you've learned a lot about synthesis since you were playing with your knobs and levers. You haven't touched a hardware synth in a long time based on the fact you didn't even know you'd sold all of them.

So...I'd be more curious to see what you're capable of doing with a hardware/analog synth today vs what you can do ITB today. THAT would be a much better comparison.

I'm a lot better at a number of things today than I was when I was in college. Can't really compare skills when I had no clue what I was doing then, to today when I at least know a bit more what I'm doing.

That's fair to a point. What hasn't changed is the fact that a stand alone analog synth is just that. It doesn't have all the goodies built into it that make what I do so easy. And if I'm recording the actual sound out of the box, there is no just tweaking the MIDI file to get it just right. It's get the take right or do it over. Otherwise I'd have to go back to my old analog setup where I ran everything MIDI out and MIDI through from synth to MIDI recorder and then back to the synth in order to direct the output to the multi track recorder. And it's been so long since I've used that setup that I'm not 100% sure that I'd know how to do it again. So why would I torture myself with that much work when I have such an easy and elegant solution in a box?

Point is, there is simply no reason to go back to what I had, which, by the way, was a setup completely void of old analogs because they didn't even have MIDI capability. Those synths I stopped using once I sold my Teac A3440. I mean let's be honest. Old analog stuff was not easy to work with. So why go back to it?

[justin3am]

I mean let's be honest. Old analog stuff was not easy to work with. So why go back to it?

Some folks enjoy the workflow. I know many people who have developed muscle memory for their analog studios (I'm talking CV and tape here, no MIDI) and getting them to do anything with a computer is like pulling teeth... not because they have a bias against the computer but because they just aren't familiar with the workflow.

Also, working with pre-MIDI analog synths has become much easier with the advent of things like Silentway and multi-output MIDI>CV converters. I can control my analog synths with MIDI and automation in the same way I can with MIDI compatible gear.

I'm not saying you are wrong, just that not everyone has the same opinion.

[wagtunes]

I mean let's be honest. Old analog stuff was not easy to work with. So why go back to it?

Some folks enjoy the workflow. I know many people who have developed muscle memory for their analog studios (I'm talking CV and tape here, no MIDI) and getting them to do anything with a computer is like pulling teeth... not because they have a bias against the computer but because they just aren't familiar with the workflow.

Also, working with pre-MIDI analog synths has become much easier with the advent of things like Silentway and multi-output MIDI>CV converters. I can control my analog synths with MIDI and automation in the same way I can with MIDI compatible gear.

I'm not saying you are wrong, just that not everyone has the same opinion.

Yeah, I get it. There were things about hardware that I enjoyed that I don't get out of software. I mean gear is cool. But the cons so outweigh the pros for me now that I just can't go back to what I had. In fact, if somebody told me I had to, I'd probably give up music altogether.

[werp]

virtual coffee just doesn't do it, I'll stick with the analog coffee.

[justin3am]

Yeah, I get it. There were things about hardware that I enjoyed that I don't get out of software. I mean gear is cool. But the cons so outweigh the pros for me now that I just can't go back to what I had. In fact, if somebody told me I had to, I'd probably give up music altogether.

I totally understand. I think everyone is entitled to their own approach and preferences when it comes to making music. No need to justify anything, it's all a matter of preference.

[OutCider]

why is this such an issue now?

Pride is a great motivator, so it would seem, hence the sword fighting using willies instead of blades.

[stillshaded]

As someone who has come up using soft synths along with analog synths basically throughout my entire music making career, I will say that, yes.. they do sound different. Duh.. Two different things are going to sound different. Doesn't that make sense?

It's basically what zerocrossing is saying: if you like a particular synths character, use it. Simple.

I had a matrix 6r.. Man that thing was beatiful. I still miss it, and I wouldn't try to replace it with software. I still have a virus ti (my personal favorite synth), but I probably use it on 30% of tracks

Nowadays I use mostly software. In my head I'm like "sound is the most important thing" and this is true, but then I think about the demo track for the little synth program for the original Sony PSP, and I'm like "don't blame the tools". I guess both statements are true, but at the end of the day, as so many others have said: workflow is king. If you make great tracks with analog synths, use that. If you make great tracks with a song PSP, use that.

One final thing.. I think eventually computers will nail the analog sound. Right now they are.. Eh 94% there. I love diva, but every time I try to recreate an ms-20 patch with it, it clearly falls short IMHO. But it is fantastic.. Don't get me wrong. The ms-20 seems like it would be one of the most difficult synths to model. It is particularly wild.

I mean really, any opinion you could possibly have on this subject has been expressed a thousand times. So I feel kind of dumb posting about it.

[Aleatoriac]

Yeah, I get it. There were things about hardware that I enjoyed that I don't get out of software. I mean gear is cool. But the cons so outweigh the pros for me now that I just can't go back to what I had. In fact, if somebody told me I had to, I'd probably give up music altogether.

Same with me regarding synths. Though I realized... Even though I've used plenty of hardware synths I've never actually played the "classics" - OB-X, the Jupiters, the CS-80, moog, or prophet...

[whyterabbyt]

'Virtual vs Analogue' ?

I prefer electroacoustic, you insensitive clod.

[wagtunes]

As someone who has come up using soft synths along with analog synths basically throughout my entire music making career, I will say that, yes.. they do sound different. Duh.. Two different things are going to sound different. Doesn't that make sense?

It's basically what zerocrossing is saying: if you like a particular synths character, use it. Simple.

I had a matrix 6r.. Man that thing was beatiful. I still miss it, and I wouldn't try to replace it with software. I still have a virus ti (my personal favorite synth), but I probably use it on 30% of tracks

Nowadays I use mostly software. In my head I'm like "sound is the most important thing" and this is true, but then I think about the demo track for the little synth program for the original Sony PSP, and I'm like "don't blame the tools". I guess both statements are true, but at the end of the day, as so many others have said: workflow is king. If you make great tracks with analog synths, use that. If you make great tracks with a song PSP, use that.

One final thing.. I think eventually computers will nail the analog sound. Right now they are.. Eh 94% there. I love diva, but every time I try to recreate an ms-20 patch with it, it clearly falls short IMHO. But it is fantastic.. Don't get me wrong. The ms-20 seems like it would be one of the most difficult synths to model. It is particularly wild.

I mean really, any opinion you could possibly have on this subject has been expressed a thousand times. So I feel kind of dumb posting about it.

Let's talk about the Matrix 6r. It was one of two Oberheim synths that I owned. Sounded like nothing else. But my God, what a nightmare interface to program. Eventually, I just gave up and used the presets.

[trimph1]

'Virtual vs Analogue' ?

I prefer electroacoustic, you insensitive clod.

Come here and say that.

Actually it would appear that I would be in the same ballpark with my tape stuff...still use the oold Wollensack reel to reel and a few strange noisemakers here for that...

[trimph1]

why is this such an issue now?

Pride is a great motivator, so it would seem, hence the sword fighting using willies instead of blades.

Sort of like this then?

[Lotuzia]

Let's talk about the Matrix 6r. It was one of two Oberheim synths that I owned. Sounded like nothing else. But my God, what a nightmare interface to program. Eventually, I just gave up and used the presets.

Works very well with a sofware editor though ( you can even build one in Cubase/Logic etc) by sysex. You can even make some kinda automations with it, but it's steppy and lags if you send too much data and saturate the input buffer/ (but for sound design its gold)