KVR Audio

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Tue Jul 28, 2015 6:43 pm

"It is based on vintage analogue routing"

So much better than digital routing.

ontol · Post by **ontol** » Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:11 pm

GaryG · Post by **GaryG** » Tue Jul 28, 2015 7:29 pm

ontol wrote: I wonder what cabling they modeled. I have some radio shack cables from the early 80's that are absolutely integral to my sound.

Pfft, amateur, I only use officially modelled, virtual Neutrik connectors, much better sense of air and soundstage.

aMUSEd · Post by **aMUSEd** » Tue Jul 28, 2015 9:08 pm

I was looking for a Carmen Electra plugin

ontol · Post by **ontol** » Tue Jul 28, 2015 11:34 pm

mztk · Post by **mztk** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:16 am

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:32 am

Don't they mean VCO -> VCF -> VCA -> ?
(Note "analog" is a term used incorrectly as a synonym for subtractive.)

I can sort of see how you'd think they meant this:

Vs.

You do have awfully vivid imaginations.

I personally ignored the "analog" bit and imagined this:

Vintage routing. Mmm. Direct from the vineyard.

fluffy_little_something · Wed Jul 29, 2015 4:29 pm

If that is the daftest blurb ever, the other press releases must be pretty good, actually...

whyterabbyt · Post by **whyterabbyt** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 5:55 pm

fluffy_little_something wrote:If that is the daftest blurb ever, the other press releases must be pretty good, actually...

Feel free to contribute something dafter, then.

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 6:06 pm

Insert any one of those "special NUGREAT-ANALOG emulation technology (TM)" bullshit and I think it can't be beat.

Especially humorous (or extremely sad ...) for those of us who know what they claim is special or new is actually what they've copied, standard code from a paper written in the 1980s.

Actually fluffy linked me this one just recently:
http://www.image-line.com/plugins/Synths/Sawer/

While programming the SAW oscillator, Maxx accidentally set some incorrect variables and immediately the sound gained bass, acquired some light but pleasing noise on the attack and an overall richer sonic spectra. Maxx realized this was no mistake but a discovery and built on this, adding some frequency modulation to give it a touch of analog authenticity and so 'Sawer' was born.

Also see here:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 3&t=443305

xoxos does a wonderful satire of the version of this same bullshit we've seen most recently.

Ph-J · Post by **Ph-J** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:00 pm

aciddose wrote:Insert any one of those "special NUGREAT-ANALOG emulation technology (TM)" bullshit and I think it can't be beat.

But is 'circuit modeling' as in Diva or Waves Element or some effects bullshit to you ?

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:12 pm

In many cases yes. At best it is a poor choice of words to describe the fact that the code attempts to produce the same result as a circuit. A circuit "model" however should aim to actually model the circuit itself rather than just the results from it. The results are then emergent from the model of the circuit, which is internally identical to any real circuit.

For example you can use spice (a real circuit model) to model a minimoog filter.

The model would have its own power supply and the current drawn by the filter circuit would be part of the numbers computed in the model. Diva does not compute power supply currents.

Do you honestly believe that what they're doing in these plugins is similar in any way to spice?

In fact it has begun to approximate spice by implementing some of the same methods developed for spice decades ago. Still though, the goals are radically different. Modelling temperature variations with the accuracy of spice is not at all a practical goal for audio software.

This is a simple case of "no, it isn't a model".

aciddose · Post by **aciddose** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:21 pm

That however has absolutely zero to do with my point.

The bullshit is when people who have absolutely no idea what "zero delay" even refers to use the term to make wild and fabulous claims about some effect it supposedly has.

See xoxos' "zero delay, delay" joke. What in f**k would be the point of a zero delay delay? This is exactly the intelligence of the majority of morons using the term "ZDF" lately.

Fact: there is no such thing as a "zero delay filter". A filter is a delay. Phase-shift is the entire purpose of a filter. Without a delay, you'd have no delay. How much more obvious could this be?

Likewise with "zero delay feedback" which I'm unaware of the source for. The term itself is so unbelievably retarded that it just leaves me speechless. "zero delay filter with feedback" could potentially make sense if it wasn't in conflict with the fact there is no such thing as a zero delay filter. "Zero group delay filter with feedback", now that actually makes sense.

camsr · Post by **camsr** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:30 pm

Since when did it become real analog Kullervo? Of course it's bullshit, it's always been.
No need to get picky with the nomenclature. Technically all these terms are abstract and could never have a valid definition. It's like asking "what is happiness", except most will give a simple answer to this question. The answers given to the definitions of "circuit modeling" are lame in comparison. I would never call a plugin or algorithm "circuit modeled" because of this. It only opens the doors to criticism of a technical nature.

Virtual analog is just a way of saying "hey guys, this doesn't sound that digital".

Ph-J · Post by **Ph-J** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:42 pm

aciddose wrote:Do you honestly believe that what they're doing in these plugins is similar in any way to spice?

hum, well, yes

actually, I thought that was the whole point, modeling the behavior of actual parts of (iconic) hardware instead of approximating the results (I don't understand anything beyond the general idea of it anyway)

I do think some of those plugins claiming to use circuit modeling sound better than many others (to my ears, anyway) so I thought this new (? in VST world at least) approach might be the reason.

About the 'ZDF' thing, I don't understand what the general idea is, so I can't comment

Daftest synth plugin press release blurb ever?