KVR Audio

memyselfandus · Post by **memyselfandus** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:34 am

What are some vst's that cover all the parameters in the synthesizer cookbook?

http://www.amazon.com/Welshs-Synthesize ... E9KM8RJ8G4

arkmabat · Post by **arkmabat** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:30 am

Could you list them?

Probably Spire, Diva, Sylenth1, Massive, Harmor

yessongs · Post by **yessongs** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 7:33 am

Synthmaster should be in the discussion as the best desert island synth.
Spectral and or Alchemy
Reaktor and Tassman both are great and available in collections that would bury you in other options,
Zebra also has a lot of support and fans.
MOOGS a good moog is always needed so Diva, Monark or Minimonsta or all 3 if your like me because they are all good.
more historic synths Arturia v collection is cheap enough when on sale for $199 and Korg legacy collection ditto. Xils labs poly KB II, OPX pro II, all when on sale.
FM- Nemesis and FM8
Z3TA and Rapture just because they are so cheap if not free in certain back issues of music mags. Definitely the best free synths ever given away in a magazine considering the libraries available that are all awesome.

Certain collections make a lot of sense like AAS modeling collection, korg legacy collection, NI Komplete, Arturia v collection.

I wish Lin Plug Tone 2 and Xils Lab would all create a collection.

The_Hidden_Goose · Post by **The_Hidden_Goose** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:04 am

I've been working through that book with Diva.

Some things need a little extra thought and tinkering as they don't always translate exactly, but the patches generally get you close to the intended sounds I'm finding.

I imagine most synths can do most of the stuff in the book though. Anything with 2 oscs with the usual saw/triangle/square selection and pulse width setting. You'll need to either read up on your synth or experiment a bit to find the correlation with the synths parameters to the standard used in the book (e.g. 70% cutoff might be different on your synth to the expected setting in the cookbook).

I haven't done it, but I think the parameter ranges are explained in the manual, so you can probably work it out from that knowledge. I've just done it by ear and figured out inuitively that correlation between book & synth.

I think the cookbook is really meant either as a basic learning reference or as a jump-pad for further tweaking (that's how I'm using it anyway) so unless you're really after *that* particular sound then it should be of use to anyone interested in learning how to get the basics with most 2-osc subtractive synths.

I was given my copy of the book by someone with an SH-101 and he uses it with that, so presumably any of the SH-101 clones might be a good start - LUSH, TAL-Bassline...things like that.

p.s...the book also comes with a CD with a synth on it that can be used to make the patches too - I've not loaded it up but doubt they'd include a synth that doesn't do what the book offers! Not sure if it's windows vst only or if there's a mac version with it though.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 8:47 am

memyselfandus wrote:What are some vst's that cover all the parameters in the synthesizer cookbook?

http://www.amazon.com/Welshs-Synthesize ... E9KM8RJ8G4

Never had that book (and maybe also don't need it at the current stage) but the synth seems to be quite basic.

Some features i found in screenshots of some Patch sheets (at the link above) are:

2 Osillators with detuning (Wavesforms: Saw, Square, Pulse, Triangle), Noise source, Osc Sync, Unison, 12dB + 24dB LPF, 1 LFO (multiple waveforms) with routing options, 2 ADSR envelopes

Those are more or less the specs of some classic analog polysynths like e.g. Prophet 5 or Jupiter 8 (emulations available from Arturia and Jupiter 8 is also included with Diva).

U-He Diva was already mentioned but besides several others including e.g. Tone2 Saurus, Xils Lab Syn'X.

Ingo

fluffy_little_something · Thu Sep 18, 2014 9:55 am

Yes, those books are usually based on a rather basic set of parameters in order to appeal to as many readers as possible.

I find images 2-6 on that Amazon page interesting, it is more or less what I had in mind with my old thread, which never really got started, though

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 0&t=387538

albertodream · Post by **albertodream** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:25 pm

The_Hidden_Goose wrote: p.s...the book also comes with a CD with a synth on it that can be used to make the patches too - I've not loaded it up but doubt they'd include a synth that doesn't do what the book offers! Not sure if it's windows vst only or if there's a mac version with it though.

The book comes with this synth:
http://www.kvraudio.com/product/scb_1_by_fred_welsh

With Synth1 you can cover all aspects of the book.

memyselfandus · Post by **memyselfandus** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:47 pm

Thanks guys. Still reading through. Does Alchemy cover it?

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 2:54 pm

albertodream wrote:
The_Hidden_Goose wrote: p.s...the book also comes with a CD with a synth on it that can be used to make the patches too - I've not loaded it up but doubt they'd include a synth that doesn't do what the book offers! Not sure if it's windows vst only or if there's a mac version with it though.
The book comes with this synth:
http://www.kvraudio.com/product/scb_1_by_fred_welsh

With Synth1 you can cover all aspects of the book.

Just noticed that key tracking in Osc could be turned off in Osc 2 (e.g. for Drone like sounds). This will reduce the amount of synths that could do it.
The Prophet 5 emulation from Arturia Prophet 5 could do that and it should also cover most other features (except switching the filter between 12dB and 24 dB).

There seem to be several synth that got a lot more features than that synth in the book so teh decison depends on which features set you realy need.

memyselfandus · Post by **memyselfandus** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 3:25 pm

I want to cover every single thing in the book. I'll be messing around with the one that comes with the book but I'd also like to find out what other VST's can handle the same stuff. Every feature. This is far better..for me personally..than continuing to buy countless VST plug-ins.

dmbaer · Post by **dmbaer** » Thu Sep 18, 2014 10:06 pm

There are very few VA synths that could not be used to construct the Welsh patches. Alchemy, for example, is many things beyond basic subtractive synthesis, but it has more than enough capability to render the simple patches in Welsh. Really, any two-or-more-oscillator instrument with a filter and an LFO will be suitable.

I didn't understand why Welsh's calibration technique for filter cutoff was so involved. It seems to me that there's a much easier and straightforward way to do it. I wrote about that here:

http://soundbytesmag.net/calibratingyou ... tivesynth/

Somebody earlier mentioned key-tracking for filters. This is an important point. As I recall, Welsh never once mentions key-tracking, so I assumed that he assumed the synth would not have that capability. So, it's important to make sure it's disabled if you want to get close to the recommended settings.

fluffy_little_something · Fri Sep 19, 2014 10:40 am

I read your calibration page, was hoping to find some info on how key-tracking and filter envelope depth influence each other because they seem to do on a synth I have, and I don't quite understand how and why

By the way, when you write "Turn filter resonance all the way up. Turn the cutoff control to the desired measurement position." you might warn your readers to turn down the slider of that DAW track or the volume of their speakers/headphones almost to zero before, else it could destroy people's hearing...

excessional · Post by **excessional** » Sat Sep 20, 2014 8:00 pm

Cheapest up to date one will be Synthmaster - currently factory edition is $48 or so if you shop around.
Also Steam keep having deals on the basic Cakewalk DAW (MC6T) and Z3ta+2 for $40 in total - which is decent value...
You can get older synths like Rapture and Z3ta for free - well the cost of a magazine.

dmbaer · Post by **dmbaer** » Sat Sep 20, 2014 9:14 pm

fluffy_little_something wrote:I read your calibration page, was hoping to find some info on how key-tracking and filter envelope depth influence each other because they seem to do on a synth I have, and I don't quite understand how and why

By the way, when you write "Turn filter resonance all the way up. Turn the cutoff control to the desired measurement position." you might warn your readers to turn down the slider of that DAW track or the volume of their speakers/headphones almost to zero before, else it could destroy people's hearing...

On the first point, I don't believe that key tracking and filter envelope depth have any effect on each other in DIVA (at least that's the way I read the doc). On the other hand, I kind of blindly assumed that key tracking at 100% would get you one octave cutoff change for one octave key position change. I've since learned never to assume anything on this point. I just measured the effect on key-tracking in Kontakt. To get a one-octave to one-octave correspondence, you need to set the depth to 10.5% - makes no sense whatever!

On the second point ...

fluffy_little_something · Sat Sep 20, 2014 9:25 pm

Try the Superwave Professional or Trance-Pro demo, the filter envelope depth and filter kf parameters do influence each other in a way I don't quite understand. As you move the kf towards max, the depth knob seems to become more or less bipolar (though not symmetrically), which otherwise it is not, as far as i can tell