Komplete 10 Date - Oct. 1 2014
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- KVRian
- 788 posts since 1 Sep, 2008 from US
Like the arp and the touch strip, but outside of that it's pretty underwhelming set of features for the price tag, no matter how good the keybed is. Not impressed with the reasoning w power supply either, even S4 can run on dimmer light settings
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- KVRist
- 114 posts since 22 Sep, 2002 from Germany
I totally agree, software is so full of parameters that you can't mirror everything on a clearly arranged hardware layout. The only solution I can see on the horizon is the extensive use of touchscreens so that you have instant access to every parameter (minority report style). But then you lose a lot of the tactile experience...BDeep wrote:Well, you know, as you yourself said, they're made to browse presets and to do a little live tweaking. And in the case of Maschine and Push, they're main goal is to bring sequencing to your fingertips.MaF wrote:Having had a look at what K10 offers I might still stay on K6.
I'm just not convinced by these "advanced" MIDI controllers like the Kontrol S keyboards, Maschine or Push. All you do is browse presets (or additional libraries you bought) and afterwards control your eight premapped parameters via eight encoders. When you want to really design your sounds or arrange your song you have to look at the screen and use the mouse. I'd like more hands-on. Is that old-fashioned?
I think it would be great if there were dedicated hardware controllers for a plug-in with knob per function (like the old MS20 controller or this guy in Berlin: synth-project.de). Then it would be fun to learn the synth inside out and everybody could live with just a quarter of all the plug-ins. The Virus TI is no the solution either, since it adds too much latency.
I'm a big fan of having a bunch of knobs in front of you and being able to tweak them. But let's face it, many modern VSTs are too complicated for hardware control. Sure you can get there to some extent, but ideally, for sound design, you'd need dedicated hardware to fit the synths architecture in order to make it intuitive (ie, oscs, filters grouped together in a way that makes sense etc). And even then, a synth like the Virus, which has all of that, and can rival with VSTs in terms of complexity, has many functions only available in the menu's. Were's the advantage in that? Give me a well designed GUI any day of the week. Although, I realise that's just me and YMMV and so forth and so on.
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- KVRAF
- 5432 posts since 25 Jan, 2007
Blimey there's a lot of negative stuff on this thread. Is it really... REALLY... so exciting to all be aiming for yet another emulation of an old subtractive synth, albeit a good one? Is the entire package of 3,269 products for a few hundred euros actually crushing waste of time because it doesn't have a new emulation of a 35 year old synth?electro wrote:That NI's Monark team didn't do a Prophet 5 for K10 is an unexpected disappointment.
Isn't it a bit more interesting to do something, well, new?
There have been hardly any comments on the new synths. Maybe there's something like Rounds out there already, and I just don't know about it. And both Polyplex and Kontour both look interesting too. They all tend to get casually dismissed as "just another three Reaktor ensembles" (like Monark, funnily enough). I couldn't possibly care less what they're hosted in, but I do care if they sound good and how they are to work with. All three are actually on sale now, too, so hopefully some feedback will come in soon.
(Never mind the new Galaxy pianos etc etc)
Just sayin' - don't mean to single you out Electro.
http://www.guyrowland.co.uk
http://www.sound-on-screen.com
W10, i7 7820X, 64gb RAM, RME Babyface, 1050ti, PT 2023 Ultimate, Cubase Pro 13
Macbook Air M2 OSX 10.15
http://www.sound-on-screen.com
W10, i7 7820X, 64gb RAM, RME Babyface, 1050ti, PT 2023 Ultimate, Cubase Pro 13
Macbook Air M2 OSX 10.15
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- KVRist
- 199 posts since 11 Jul, 2004
My x-station runs can run an audio interface and synth with only USB power.softska wrote:Like the arp and the touch strip, but outside of that it's pretty underwhelming set of features for the price tag, no matter how good the keybed is. Not impressed with the reasoning w power supply either, even S4 can run on dimmer light settings
Speaking of which, for the price, I would have at least expected them to throw in an audio interface as well. It's basically a proprietary midi controller for a whole chunk of cash. It does, however, make the ultranova look like a bargain, being cheaper, having an audio interface, a whole synth, AND Automap chucked in which will not only work with Komplete, but with a bunch of other VSTs.
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- KVRAF
- 1594 posts since 16 Jan, 2010 from Denver
So I may have missed it somewhere along in this thread. Do you get the new controller software even if you dont own one of the new keyboards? So you can use it with something else but able to go through all presets of all NI software in one place?
So far I think IMHO without molekular its a no upgrade for me, but i think at this point I have lost all my GAS, so without some sort of major update to something I already like there isnt much pushing me to upgrade (and this coming from back at K8, even going from 8->10 I dont see much I would personally use). Though having some sort of software that integrates all the patches somewhere I could see useful as long as I dont have to buy an overpriced keyboard to use it
So far I think IMHO without molekular its a no upgrade for me, but i think at this point I have lost all my GAS, so without some sort of major update to something I already like there isnt much pushing me to upgrade (and this coming from back at K8, even going from 8->10 I dont see much I would personally use). Though having some sort of software that integrates all the patches somewhere I could see useful as long as I dont have to buy an overpriced keyboard to use it
Last edited by ezelkow1 on Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- KVRAF
- 23077 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia
That NI's Monark team didn't do a Prophet 5 for K10 is an unexpected disappointment.[/quote]electro wrote:Pro53 was abandoned, the others are maintained (updates for compatibility, new formats like AAX, preset integration etc.) but it remains to be seen if they are being developed for new versions.
I'm thinking Reaktor needs a proper update that allows multicore and SSE at Core level before that happens. So, perhaps R6/K11?
- KVRAF
- 3889 posts since 28 Jan, 2011 from MEXICO
Having tryied Push and Maschine I think the integration is superb and that if done right a dedicated keyboard controller with the same level of integration for synths would be fantastic.MaF wrote:Having had a look at what K10 offers I might still stay on K6.
I'm just not convinced by these "advanced" MIDI controllers like the Kontrol S keyboards, Maschine or Push. All you do is browse presets (or additional libraries you bought) and afterwards control your eight premapped parameters via eight encoders. When you want to really design your sounds or arrange your song you have to look at the screen and use the mouse. I'd like more hands-on. Is that old-fashioned?
I think it would be great if there were dedicated hardware controllers for a plug-in with knob per function (like the old MS20 controller or this guy in Berlin: synth-project.de). Then it would be fun to learn the synth inside out and everybody could live with just a quarter of all the plug-ins. The Virus TI is no the solution either, since it adds too much latency.
This NI kontrol s controllers have the concept, probaly they didn't care for sound design or synth specific use.
A good universal synth controller could have 4 groups of 8 knobs each one for: 1 Timbre/OSC generators, 2.- Filters, 3.- Envelopes, 4.- Modulations/FX. Obviously some synths would need pages inside those groups but it would be an excelent point to start instead of going throgh 12 pages of 8 parameters each one.
Novation, Korg and now NI have done the encoders+screen, I dont get why they stick to only 8 controls.
dedication to flying
- KVRAF
- 35249 posts since 14 Sep, 2002 from In teh net
Plugins these days have so many params if you had a knob box that covered them all it would be next to impossible to remember what does what - that's why I prefer to use a software/hardware hybrid like Kore as I can break a gui down into units of 8 knobs/buttons and it tells me via the display what every param is. I tend to have a dedicated perform page with the most used controls easily accessible and if I want to get into sound design I have dedicated pages for that too.MaF wrote:I totally agree, software is so full of parameters that you can't mirror everything on a clearly arranged hardware layout. The only solution I can see on the horizon is the extensive use of touchscreens so that you have instant access to every parameter (minority report style). But then you lose a lot of the tactile experience...BDeep wrote:Well, you know, as you yourself said, they're made to browse presets and to do a little live tweaking. And in the case of Maschine and Push, they're main goal is to bring sequencing to your fingertips.MaF wrote:Having had a look at what K10 offers I might still stay on K6.
I'm just not convinced by these "advanced" MIDI controllers like the Kontrol S keyboards, Maschine or Push. All you do is browse presets (or additional libraries you bought) and afterwards control your eight premapped parameters via eight encoders. When you want to really design your sounds or arrange your song you have to look at the screen and use the mouse. I'd like more hands-on. Is that old-fashioned?
I think it would be great if there were dedicated hardware controllers for a plug-in with knob per function (like the old MS20 controller or this guy in Berlin: synth-project.de). Then it would be fun to learn the synth inside out and everybody could live with just a quarter of all the plug-ins. The Virus TI is no the solution either, since it adds too much latency.
I'm a big fan of having a bunch of knobs in front of you and being able to tweak them. But let's face it, many modern VSTs are too complicated for hardware control. Sure you can get there to some extent, but ideally, for sound design, you'd need dedicated hardware to fit the synths architecture in order to make it intuitive (ie, oscs, filters grouped together in a way that makes sense etc). And even then, a synth like the Virus, which has all of that, and can rival with VSTs in terms of complexity, has many functions only available in the menu's. Were's the advantage in that? Give me a well designed GUI any day of the week. Although, I realise that's just me and YMMV and so forth and so on.
btw the Virus 'latency' issue isn't as much of a problem as you think - it's only an issue if you want to play it 'live' as an instrument but then you can switch to using the hardware analog outs instead of the USB interface, or just play it entirely as a hardware synth and just use the Ti control plugin when you want to mix down inside a DAW - and there you don't need it to have zero latency and you get latency compensation anyway. It also makes a nifty synth controller as it has over 20 knobs and customisable midi templates.
- KVRAF
- 3321 posts since 2 Jul, 2007
Too little for too much, even with the upgrade discount.
I do not need 3 new synths, as nice as they might be - I really got my hands full learning the 8 or so NI synths I use constantly. I need to be able to save my presets in Reaktor in a quick, easy, intuitive way. I need the labyrinthine Kontakt sample directory and file management system to be straightened out and made more user friendly - I don't even know where to start.
Oh, is that too negative? I forgot, I'm in Happyland Forest, where nothing negative or critical must ever be said and offenders are to be hung from the neck until they cheer up.
I do not need 3 new synths, as nice as they might be - I really got my hands full learning the 8 or so NI synths I use constantly. I need to be able to save my presets in Reaktor in a quick, easy, intuitive way. I need the labyrinthine Kontakt sample directory and file management system to be straightened out and made more user friendly - I don't even know where to start.
Oh, is that too negative? I forgot, I'm in Happyland Forest, where nothing negative or critical must ever be said and offenders are to be hung from the neck until they cheer up.
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- KVRAF
- 5432 posts since 25 Jan, 2007
Your martyr-like plight at having to commune with people less miserable than you is deeply moving.SODDI wrote:Oh, is that too negative? I forgot, I'm in Happyland Forest, where nothing negative or critical must ever be said and offenders are to be hung from the neck until they cheer up.
http://www.guyrowland.co.uk
http://www.sound-on-screen.com
W10, i7 7820X, 64gb RAM, RME Babyface, 1050ti, PT 2023 Ultimate, Cubase Pro 13
Macbook Air M2 OSX 10.15
http://www.sound-on-screen.com
W10, i7 7820X, 64gb RAM, RME Babyface, 1050ti, PT 2023 Ultimate, Cubase Pro 13
Macbook Air M2 OSX 10.15
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- KVRist
- 93 posts since 1 Jul, 2009 from New York
I'm in the same boat as you and may have some advice that could help. I think the way to do it as cost-effectively as possible is to first update to K10 and then from K10 to K10U. Right now Musician's Friend is taking pre-orders for the K10 update at $149 and they also have a Labor Day sale that gives you 10% off if you order today. So I just pre-ordered K10 (I'm upgrading from K8) for $134, which seems like a pretty sweet deal. I figure later I'll take advantage of the inevitable 50% off for the K10-K10U upgrade and pick that up for $199.Gribs wrote:I thought that if the upgrade price from Komplete 9 -> Komplete 10 Ultimate is in the right range, I might go with Ultimate to get Molekular and some other stuff, but it looks like there is no real break in price.
It's not chicken feed but it's better than the current direct upgrade price from NI or elsewhere. And I guess I'll have to wait to get my hands on Molekular, but I'm willing to in order to save a few bucks.
Hope this helps ...