IKM SampleTank 3 (ST3) Now Available

[BERFAB]

Is she a musician as well? Because if not, I think a move toward sainthood might be in order.

Sorry, I had to chuckle at this in general and because (though I know you didn't mean it this way) it reads as if being a musician and a saint are mutually exclusive. Well, I guess technically they aren't but in practice there are likely very few that would qualify for both

Yeah, I missed that, but you're right.

My personal experience is like many here on KVR. I have this obsession that has been with me all my life. And so, every spare minute I have (not much given work, family, etc.) is in my little studio. It makes me smile. And while my wife UNDERSTANDS this, it's a world that she otherwise knows nothing about. And if I was to complain about a plugin to her, it would require hours of basic explanation before I even got to the part about what the problem is. So, IMHO, any display of empathy would qualify for sainthood.

As for musicians and saints, I'm reminded that Springsteen once said that he was sure that he was going to heaven. He then added, "Of course I'll miss the band..."

Cheers
-B

[basslinemaster]

It was smooth for me, especially since we have a bit of an advantage with the previous libraries being IK products

But you couldn't use a screen recorder and produce a simple video of it? Incredible. For a company that wants to sell a product, you seem to be making very little effort to give your potential customers reasons to buy it - like a few hours of video, demoing thousands of presets, full pieces of music with multiple parts, etc.

We have our internal people who make our videos, and if I did an "off the cuff" video that did not represent IK and go through the proper channels (especially showing a product that has not been released yes in a form that may not be final and showed something not for public consumption at the time, etc) it would not be a good idea - I like keeping my job (I've done videos before, it just isn't something I do by the seat of my pants for IK). We're a large enough company to have a method to what we do and the official videos will come

Precisely. Right there is your problem: "the official videos WILL come". It's normal for a company to produce all of those videos BEFORE you start to try to sell the product. What a crazy idea. I was suggesting that your company produce more videos. How you can't get one member of staff to spend one day doing this is beyond me.

and at that time (same with anything that is not coming during the preorder period) and if the content of a certain video is a showstopper than the option exists to wait until it is out.

I think you mean "then", not "than".

You are welcome to make suggestions about how IK does business at http://www.ikmultimedia.com/contact-us/ ... IKForm.php and if you feel you can contribute directly and have the skill set then we also have job listings on our site. The latter based on your assumptions about what IK is doing (note that we have already exceeded our preorder goals and we have more than a good idea what we're doing - please see past data on the free version issue that seems to be the cornerstone of your armchair business analysis of IK and you'll note that SampleTank Free with full features including import did not get released for years after SampleTank 2.x was released. That's just one piece of data you may be missing, but I've already suggested direct contact or applying for a job if you think you can help take it to the next level)

Hilarious. I don't need to work for you to give you free advice, which is, of course, correct.
So the fact that Sampletank Free wasn't released for years after Sampletank somehow means you're right in this case?
Please explain to us how your company came to the decision that preventing existing ST2 owners from buying an ST3 player (notice I said "buying", not giving it away for free, which would have been the right thing to do, seeing as almost every other company gives away 64 bit upgrades for free to existing customers, and this then generates goodwill - something you could easily capitalise on) is going to make you more money than selling it to them for $30, with a generous upgrade path to the full version, ten free patch downloads every month for the first year, to get them 'addicted', etc.etc.

I also have to laugh as none of you know what I do for a living, nor how much money I make, what I have developed, etc. yet presume that I am incompetent (appeal to authority fallacy) and that IKM just couldn't possibly be in the wrong, for ignoring what their customers want.

Can you explain to us why you are charging a disgraceful 15 euros to re-download only 2GB of Sampletank Expansion data? I'm still waiting for an explanation of that, before I would consider buying ST3, and can you assure us that you won't be charging us anything to re-download ST3 in the future? Or will it be 15 euros every time. After all, 33GB is like the whole of the internet, isn't it? (Sarcasm)

[jsp1979]

Now I understand what your problem is. You didn't understand what I actually wrote.
I was suggesting (obviously, since nobody else misread what I wrote) that they sell the full version AND the ST3 player...
We know what their strategy is, as you explained above - and? Their strategy is wrong, it is losing them money, pissing off existing customers, etc. And LOL at the white knights who have come in to defend IKM's bad business decisions. It truly astounds me the way some people are incapable of even understanding the most basic thing. Where on earth did I give the impression that I wanted IKM to NOT sell the full version, but instead begin by just selling the ST3 player?

Yes, I know you meant they would sell both. I never said otherwise. I simply noted that to maintain the same revenue stream, for each loss of sale for the full version, they would have to sell 3 and a third player versions in your model.

My argument is simple:
1) You claim that selling a player in addition to selling the library+player version would make IK *more* money than their current strategy.
2) I claim that your claim is far from obvious and that you have no support for it.
End of argument.

It's fine if you're ticked IK doesn't have the engine for separate sale. It's fine if you think it's a horrible business decision. You may be correct. I'm just pointing out (as others have done in this thread) that your "obvious truth" that IK would make more money by also offering a player-only version has no support.

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

Typo fixed, thanks for the heads up, basslinemaster.

Details about the preorder and are available at http://www.ikmultimedia.com/news/?item_id=4328

We have our FAQ page at http://www.ikmultimedia.com/faq for any general policy questions and our support team is available at http://www.ikmultimedia.com/contact-support for technical issues or even pre-sales questions.

If anybody did not get their 64-bit updates to AmpliTube or T-RackS that were free of charge to existing users of the current versions (details about SampleTank 3 being a different case are on our forum http://www.ikmultimedia.com/forum/viewt ... =12&t=6909 for those interested) you should make sure you have the latest version of those programs available in your IK User Area at http://www.ikmultimedia.com/userarea

We do not have a specific time or time zone for the opening of SampleTank 3 downloads but you will receive an email notification (edit - to be clear, it will contain your serial number and instructions to register and download). We do have a global presence, but I apologize if you are nearing the 24th where you are and don't see the email and download during an early part of your day. We will do our best to get the serials out and the downloads open as early as possible.

Thank you for all of the interest and excitement, I know there is a lot of anticipation for this release and I will be happy to see it finally in the hands of those that are interested in it. I will provide any updates and news on anything SampleTank 3 related as soon as I can. I will likely hit our official forum post about it first, if anybody is interested in checking there too: http://www.ikmultimedia.com/forum/viewt ... =12&t=7598

[basslinemaster]

Yes, I know you meant they would sell both. I never said otherwise. I simply noted that to maintain the same revenue stream, for each loss of sale for the full version, they would have to sell 3 and a third player versions in your model.

What 'loss of sale'? I think everybody will agree there are plenty of ST2 owners who don't want/can't afford ST3 right now.

My argument is simple:
1) You claim that selling a player in addition to selling the library+player version would make IK *more* money than their current strategy.
2) I claim that your claim is far from obvious and that you have no support for it.
End of argument.

It's fine if you're ticked IK doesn't have the engine for separate sale. It's fine if you think it's a horrible business decision. You may be correct. I'm just pointing out (as others have done in this thread) that your "obvious truth" that IK would make more money by also offering a player-only version has no support.

Of course it has support. Those who want ST3 full version are going to buy it. Those who only want a 64 bit player and don't want the ST3 content aren't going to buy it. Those who only want a 64 bit player and can't afford ST3 right now, aren't going to buy it. Both of those two groups would buy an ST3 player at a no-brainer price, and be susceptible to buying the full version later on, at a discount. It's simple maths.

ST3 Full sales + ST3 Player sales > ST3 Full sales.

How can it possibly not be? Unless you are suggesting there would be no ST3 Player sales if they offered it! Or unless you are suggesting there would be sufficiently fewer ST3 Full sales that the ST3 Player sales would be less than that amount. I can't see any way that can happen, an ST3 player at a no-brainer price would sell like hotcakes.

[basslinemaster]

Peter, can you assure us that you won't be charging us anything to re-download ST3 in the future? Or will it be 15 euros every time.

[neverenoughfunk]

wow!!! ST 3 is almost here... i have to wait 2 to 3 weeks for the box version... but i waited this long... what is another 2 to 3 weeks...

my predictions... i said thanksgiving 2014... and i was way off on that one... but i also said the the DOW JONES would be over 17000 point... currently 17091... therefore... half right...



p.s. just hoping that ST 3 is bug free... because i would hate to read those threads...

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

Good news! The Sounds page for SampleTank 3 has been updated and now lists all of the instruments. http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/sa ... k-3-sounds

[basslinemaster]

Good news! The Sounds page for SampleTank 3 has been updated and now lists all of the instruments. http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/sa ... k-3-sounds

So is it going to cost us 15 euros if we want to re-download ST3 in the future or not? A lot of people will be p**sed off if they find they have to shell out another 15 euros in a year's time because their hard drive crashed, or whatever. I can only presume by your lack of an answer, that the answer is yes.

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

My lack of answer, basslinemaster, is because I pointed you to resources to answer your questions already. I won't be "assuring" you of anything, our policies are what they are, are documented as such, and will be what they will be going forward and I do not have a crystal ball. Nobody has to pay anything at the present if they back up their sounds after downloading during the much-increased timeframe which is all part of the thorough instructions that are received with each digital download purchase which has sound libraries so nobody is left surprised.

Are you interested in ordering SampleTank 3 since you have some questions? That would be great news. I can also get you to someone to answer anything that I myself cannot.

[Mace404]

Guess that answers the question with a yes.

[basslinemaster]

Nobody has to pay anything at the present if they back up their sounds after downloading during the much-increased timeframe which is all part of the thorough instructions that are received with each digital download purchase which has sound libraries so nobody is left surprised.

So is this made clear BEFORE you purchase, i.e. on the product page, and on the ordering page?
I can't work out why you just didn't say "Yes, it will cost 15 euros to re-download ST3, after such and such a time".
My main question is WHY are you asking for any payment whatsoever? I can rent an entire virtual server for a month for £3.99.

[JonSolo]

This has been a great read...

I ordered my upgrade through Sweetwater and look forward to it tomorrow.

There are dozens of companies in the music software business that charge for subsequent downloads of large libraries. Air is one that comes to mind in addition to IK Multimedia. To demand a guarantee that this process be eliminated is crazy. Bandwidth cost money. A 3TB standalone USB drive is more than adequate (and inexpensive) to backup your software (I know, I use one myself). Of course this is really not even relevant to the discussion...IKM like every other company, has a policy. It is not anyone's business to make unsolicited suggestions to modify that policy.

Companies make decisions every day that cost them money, rob them of profits, or seemingly ignore their customers or clients. This will rarely be out of a desire to lose money or alienate their clientele.

It is possible that money could be lost if IKM does not sell a core Sampletank 3 with no samples for 1/3 of the CURRENT ($99) upgrade cost (which is a stupid suggestion cause development costs a LOT of money) but in all likelyhood, doing so would "cheapen" or lessen the new Sampletank product. It is like asking Korg to sell you the insides/engine of their new Kronos keyboard for 1/3 the cost so you can retrofit it inside your old Korg Triton. It would be silly and not make good business sense.

The only mistake that I see with IKM is not updating the old engine to 64 bit. But clearly it was explained the cost and direction was never factored in to the original.

So we have a rewrite, which I hope is glorious. Their other products have been good (albeit sometimes issue-some) and I expect no less (or more) from this.

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

New page, the current policy being debated is documented and had been discussed with suggestions relayed (it was also extended and messaged to users in the download and installation instructions better and better to make sure it was clear over time to avoid confusion and improve this policy based on feedback) so I'll move on and in case anybody missed the full sounds list (again, new page): http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/sa ... k-3-sounds

[BERFAB]

Frankly, I'm surprised at how cheap the full product upgrade was (through Sweetwater's sale). And not only do you get ST3, but also the ST2.5 upgraded sounds are included. So no ST2 folks need to shell out for a re-download.

And I've got all my other libraries on disc, so I should be good to go, and looking forward to it.

Just one question: Does anyone know how Sweetwater purchasers (or any other 3rd party purchasers) are supposed to get the product? Is there an email that goes out with the codes? Is everyone coordinated to get an email at the same time? What's the plan?

[I know that's actually 4 questions, but you get the idea...]

Cheers
-B